[sebastian]

I apologize for the irrelevance of this post, but i just found out and i have to rant somewhere without sounding like a lunatic (well, i'll probably sound like a lunatic anyway, but maybe not as much so).

So, why does my ex getting married make me angry? I mean, i've had other ex-girlfriends get married since we broke up, and it hasn't effected me that much other than the usual annoyance at seeing other people happy whereas my life is in virtual shambles. I guess what it is, is that this one i really liked. And she broke up with me. And it was not amicable. It was a seething mass of jealous hatred on my part and a capriciously wistful indifference on hers.

She was tres cool. An artist. Quirky enough to keep me interested, sexy enough to keep me satisfied, and tender enough to hold my heart. My ego has never been able to accept the fact that she broke up with me. I don't know why. I don't have any positive feelings toward her anymore. There are millions of girls who i would prefer to date than her at this point.

I guess what it is, is that i always wanted to show her what she missed. I wanted her to be jealous of my life. I wanted her to grow up alone and miserable and remonstrating herself every single second of every single day for the fact that she left me the way she did. And now she's married. Happy. All is well with her.

I know, i know...maybe a healthy response would be to say that i'm happy for her. That, i've put aside my anger and grown much in the years since we've split up. But it would be a lie. I hope she gives birth to mutants.

Whew. Glad i got that off my chest. If anyone feels like posting their broken heart stories...or rather, broken ego stories (because really, that's what this is all about. I don't think it was ever about love), please do so.
And this does have something to do with DP, since it's an ego thing, for all of you nay-sayers out there.

What's really exciting about all this is that i'm going to the dentist today. What better way to exorcise anger than have some smiling lunatic drill holes in my teeth.

s.

 

[jft]

Sebastian. Was she my old girlfriend too? Almost the same story here, except that when my gal, after two years, winged out for the last time (she had major trust and emotional issues and saw men as evil throw away gadgets) she bought a home three houses down the road from mine, so I get to see her everyday with her boyfriends (potential throw away gadgets) lined up at the door. I think most guys (and gals) harbor the feelings you do. They may idealistically want the best for the other, I guess I do for mine, but primordially there are those other thoughts lurking in all of us. My anger(after the fact) was directed at her illness and my powerlessness over it. The hurt came in realizing she was my best friend and that was gone.

I really liked your comment of love versus ego being ripped.

I found comfort realizing that what we both have experienced is one of the most common experiences humans have, at least if you believe what 90% of all songs are saying. Hang in there
jft

 

[sebastian]

(she had major trust and emotional issues and saw men as evil throw away gadgets)

Sounds very familiar.

Thanks for the response jft. You know, what really bothered me about her was the fact that she was so into me at the time. Suggesting we marry, how do i love thee, let me count the ways, kind of thing. And yet on a dime, she broke up with me. Granted, i didn't appreciate what i had, and i have major issues with trust and ego...in the sense that i ALWAYS have to be the focus of everyone's attention, all the time. And believe me, this can get exhausting for significant others. But the way she broke up...it was just so callous. As if she was so utterly indifferent to me. And now, this whole marriage fiasco is just opening up the wound again. It's truly as if my ego is saying, "What? But, you had me. Why on earth would you want anyone else when you had me?" And like it can't reconcile it or something. Like i'm getting some DOES NOT COMPUTE error flash up on the screen.

Anyway, i don't know...whatever...tonight, i shall be a morose little sebastian, that's for sure. If another mod finds this OFF TOPIC material, feel free to move it there. Everything feels off topic these days.

s.

 

[JasonFar]

Don't worry Sebastian, I used to jerk off to my mom.

We're all fuck ups here. Find solace in that.

8)

 

[Guest]

Not trying to be.........competitive here or anything (as if I could top Jason's response), but maybe more under the heading of "love bites", I can recount my experience.
Many of you have read at least parts of it before, but basically is goes something like this:
When I was in my early twenties, I met a girl and fell in love (with the girl). And, to the extent possible for her, I think she fell in love with me. Ours was a stormy relationship. I think we were both dealing with strong emotions for the first time. And she was probably the one true love of my life. We had been seeing each other for a year or so, and talk of marriage was coming up more often. We were both nearly out of school, and were planning where we would live, thinking about kids, etc.
We were in Vegas celebrating her 21st birthday. She was in the shower and I went down to play some games. Came back up to the room and she was gone. Went back downstairs looking around for her, went to a couple of other casinos, but no Lin. Waiting several hours, worry mounting. All her stuff was still in the room. It's as if she had just vanished.
Next day I notifed the police. After a few hours of checking around, talking to people, etc., they decided it might be fun to hold me as "a person of interest" in her disappearance. As I said, our's was a stormy affair, and apparently one of the hotel employees suggested we had been fighting.
Anyway...........after 24 hours in a holding cell populated mostly by people constantly throwing up (drunks), I was released. Still though, no girlfriend. I was just about crazy with worry by this time. Stayed in Vegas for another couple of days, looking everywhere I could think of. Eventually gave up and came back home.
Two days later her mother called, to let me know Lin was in L.A. at her grandmother's. Seems she had come to the decision that she and I weren't meant for each other after all, and had hopped a bus to the City of Angels.
Why she didn't at least leave me a note I can only guess.
What I do know is that she pretty much literally ripped my heart out of my chest, dropped it to the ground, and jumped up and down on it.
I was heart broken, to say the least.
The one woman I ever truly loved just up and left without a word.

Years later, and I mean YEARS later - she called me up to wish me Happy Birthday. On my birthday even. We got together soon after.
I was long over the original heartache, but what I immediately found was that - love has no time limit. When I saw her again, it's as if I had just seen her last the day before. All the feelings were still there. Very weird sensation actually, as I had gone for years without even thinking of her.
So, here was sweet little Lin. She had been extremely conservative back in the old days. Our sex live consisted of ........ well, no sex. That was challening for me, but I managed to make it through O.K. by finding it elsewhere. I sat there over coffee with a silly smile on my face as she explained what she had been up to since we last saw each other. 38 years old, a coke addicted stripper, living at home with her parents because she was broke due to certain legal difficulties. Oh, and as a bonus - she thanked me (after 18 YEARS) for helping her discover she is really gay. Now, and this is sort of side note, but to all the gay or pending gay women out there, here's a hint - there is really no reason to tell a guy he's why you turned gay. It's unnecessary information, how's that.

So, the women who ripped my heart of my chest earlier, by telling me how much she loved me then just disappearing into the night, showed up again half a life later just to let me know how wrong about her I had been back in the old days. Made it seem as if all those feelings I had for her had been based on a lie. A lie that I myself had made up. The lie I had created called Lin.
Everything I thought I knew about her - gone. She just took it all away.
And, as if on cue - guess who just now paged me? Honest. The woman who has been trying to shred my emotions for all of my adult life.
THAT'S weird. Maybe it's a sign or something......

If I have any advice it would be this - let the past stay in the past. I had reconciled things very nicely, and only had the good feelings left. She showed up again with her ridiculous story...........I should have just got up from the table and left. Instead I have let her stay in the picture, as if I'm still trying to make her into who I wanted her to be. She is no longer a dancer, although considering her age I suppose she could still shake 'em for tips. Very attractive woman. No, now she is involved in some Internet based scam. Still going to school by the way. Has I don't know how many degrees now, including a masters in some type of psychology.

How does this relate to DP? Welp, I had been doing fine until she showed up again. Yes, DP'ed, but I was making it. I have been in a free-fall ever since. And I can't seem to let go. She brings out the good feelings from the old days, but the conundrum she represents is tearing me apart. Not to mention posing a very direct threat to my marriage, etc.
And I can't seem to let go.

I can't speak for woman, but when it comes to love - men are idiots. Probably some heretofore unknown gene that somehow causes us to be complete dorks in matters of romance.
Anyway, I suppose I should return her page now.............

 

[jft]

Sebastian. Your word "indifference" says it all for me too. That is what nailed me. This is so wierd becasue your posts are out of the same novel I lived. This gal and I linked up as the ultimate "soul mates" as she would put it, how I was the answer to her prayers to get over her issues with men, how we would make the world a greater place as we played out our lives together.... on into adnauseum. I was indeed apprehensive about all the talk, but she was such a good person and a good friend, smart and so similiar to me in philosophy. I became convinced she was right. Granted that infatuation still exists past high school years, and granted one has to be aware that the hormones flow that first year and makes ones mind work different, but I thought we were above that. I sunk my life into her, helping her out in every crisis, taking care of her kids, being there emotionally for her until I would drop. Then the bomb, she jsut up and left leaving me standing naked. The indiffererence is what killed me, it was almost nonchalant for her, jsut another one bites the dust. I reeled for a long time, and it was not until I spoke with her ex husbands and her old friends that I realized it was a pattern with her and then my bewilderment subsided. As I mentioned her indifference was so great she could even jsut move three houses down and all was fine. She even bought the house her exhusband grew up in.

A side note to this is the frequency that restraining orders are handed to old boyfriends. Granted most restraining orders are needed, but I wonder how many are issued to guys that are left holding the emotional bag while she skips away in indifference. The obvious result is he is angry, bewildered and maybe wants to talk. She jsuts wants to get on with her life. He asks to talk again. Now he has a restraining order. Moral of the story is do not ever play with anothers life or emotions, guys or gals. It is too serious for either gender to do it to another.
jft

 

[Homeskooled]

Wow....same thing happened to myself recently. Its odd....I've had plenty of friends who had nasty breakups which they had brought on themselves. They knew why it ended, and in a way, I think that makes it easier. I was dating someone this past fall, and the end of the relationship came from absolutely nowhere. I could see something coming.....I sensed that she was acting a little more distant. But not a week before she had been talking about marriage. Hmm, I thought, very odd. Well, you wouldnt talk about marriage and then break up with someone, would you? No, of course not! I was just being silly. Oh, SC, she was 21 too. But it took a turn for the worst within about a week. She decided that she didnt want to date ever again. She read a book called I Kissed Dating Goodbye which espouses the idea that one should not date - one should court. Its an evangelical book on bringing back dignity to dating. Its an extremist view of relationships which goes way, way too far. It recommends not even kissing until the marriage altar! Yeah right! See ya! So I asked her if she wanted to break up, she said yeah, and that was the end. But it went from good to bad to ugly in a week, with no provocation. And the relationship had lasted half a year. Women are just on a completely different plane of existence. I think that testosterone focuses men. Women are kind of all over the page - they just dont care as much about sex, dating, etc....as guys. Oh, and SC, the right thing to do at this point would be to NOT answer that page.

Peace
Homeskooled

 

[sebastian]

Ahh, my wounded brothers...thanks for your replies...hearing about other stories is helping me through this dark night. The wine isn't hurting either.

jft: It's funny that you said that about how you talked to her ex-boyfriends and found out that she had done that kind of thing a lot. I actually had strangers coming up to me WHILE i was dating her and telling me what she'd done to them. They would speak of how cold she was, and how she lied to them and she would lie to me. One man, who was probably the only one among her suitors who actually made any money, offered me $20 to dump a bowl of soup on her, and make it look like an accident (I was a waiter/bartender at the time). Naturally, i defended her. I tried to be as empathetic as possible to these sorry sods who were slobbering up to me with their sob stories, but secretly i was thinking to myself, "Well yeah...obviously she dumped YOU. You're not "sebastian"." Always, i thought myself immune. And it wasn't because i thought myself so handsome, smart, funny, or what have you. It was because SHE would go on and on about how much she loved me. It was in the way she talked, the way she looked, the way she sighed as our bodies pressed against each other. It wasn't ambiguous. She loved me.

And then it happened. In a heartbeat. In the time it takes a car to crash...she was gone. And it wasn't like she was gone and apologetic and teary-eyed and all that. She was simply on to the next thing. Our very last day together...about a week after we had officially ended, i was leaving town for good. I had to call her to remind her i was even leaving and practically beg to get some face time with her before i headed back to Toronto. My last hour in town. To never see her again. She spent that time mostly talking about chickens.

SC: That's quite the story. I would be the last one that should try to give you advice, but HomeSkooled is right...you shouldn't answer that page. But you probably will. I would too.

What you said about all the memories flooding back is spot on as well for me. I've seen my ex i think twice since we parted. Each time, as hard as i tried to stay strong and resolute, i turned, nonetheless, into a stuttering blabbering mess. It's Pavlovian i think. But whatever promises i've made to myself regarding her fly right out the window, and if she so much as hinted that we could get back together, i would've bounced back to her house like a hungry lap dog.

See, this kind of thing doesn't help the DP either, because they completely change from who you thought they were. The reality is torn asunder because they have difficulty telling the truth in the first place, or maybe it's because we tend to idealize them and we want to create our own truth.

HS: I agree. Women are all over the page. It's amazing to think, but it's true. But the strange thing is, is that with my ex-gf, i thought she was unmarriable. I mean she really is a basket case. Or she was last time i saw her. She's borderline psychotic...truly. I couldn't imagine, after we broke up, her ever getting together with anyone else for longer than we did. She was just too capricious...too flighty.

Anyway, what does one say. The truth of the matter is...as sad as it may be...women are heartless, empty ghouls who are interested in only two things in life: Themselves and themselves. All right, i guess that's a little harsh. I mean, i wonder what women whom i have dumped have said about me? But then, i was never this absent...this cold. I always left the door open for friendship. I mean, i don't know. I guess she did too, but i guess it's just that people shouldn't say they love you if it isn't true. You'll all have to pardon me. I'm quite bitter tonight.

Women of the world: GROW UP!

s.

p.s. "Women of the world" doesn't include all you lovely little angels on this board. I'm talking about all the other ones.

 

[Guest]

Jason,please say it isn't true.Honestly it's too disturbing ask any mother :?:

Sebastian just your ego at play.Nobody enjoys that kind of rejection.
Good thing you are over her ,I'm not being sarcastic,it's a good thing,imagine if you still loved her?That would be hard.

 

[sleepingbeauty]

not to take this too far off topic.. but ive jerked off to worse.
WEEEEEIRDOOOOOOOOOOSSSSS!!! :twisted:

 

[Martinelv]

Jesus H Christ Jason. You jerked off 'to' your mum ? What, in front of her ? That does need serious medical attention. Like nuclear irradiation, and lots of it.

I must be strange. I can only 'get excited' by the mundane. My fantasies are very tedious, like meeting a very ordinary girl and having very ordinary sex with her. Then cutting off her head and using it as a lampshade.

Anyway, back to the original post, I hope my ex-wife starts porking her way around the british male population, hee hee, because I've dosed her up with all sorts of hideous sexually transmitted diseases. Nothing fatal unfortunately, but some of them arepretty goddam grizzily. Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh.

 

[JasonFar]

My fantasies are very tedious, like meeting a very ordinary girl and having very ordinary sex with her. Then cutting off her head and using it as a lampshade.

LOL. That's priceless.

But yeah, I don't find it so strange, if you consider I hated my father to death and he was my #1 enemy in so many respects, and my mother was at times motherly but at many other times hugely distant and disowning. I.E. not a mother in many respects. Also a very attractive woman, mind you -- I get it from somewhere.

It's strange though even having dinner with the family. I can't look my dad in the eye, out of a sheer inability to via my own disgust (though I do occasionally break through that), and when I look my mom in the eye it's just... strange. I don't know how to explain it but it's "off" -- in too many ways I don't feel like her son at all, but rather just a stranger, but I am her son, and WHO THE FUCK KNOWS (my mom is pretty psychologically "off" I guess... narcisissistic I suppose, among other things), but I wouldn't put it past her to have sexual thoughts in the past of her sons (and I'm the first born).

Not to self-induldge in my Freudian past-wet dreams or anything and hijack Sebastian's post (my advice to Sebastian -- you need to go hit something... You're real self must be suffocating under that ego, lol), though.... However, rather than induldge in our own narcissistic bullshit mind games we play on ourselves, how about we let SleepingBeauty tell us the marvelous creatures that have titilated her sexual organs (via fantasy, of course).

Interesting Marty re:sexually transmitted diseases. For whatever reason last night I dreamt I was somewhere, and this guy was having sex with something (a woman, I presume, but I don't remember), and then he started going off like "fuck I have hemroids." I asked him why it was bad or something and I think he said "because it burns!". Awesome.

 

[gimpy34]

I think most everyone here can relate in some form or the other. I dated a girl in college for about a year. When it comes down to it, I'm not sure I even liked her all too much from the beginning, but at some point during that relationship was when I got DP and I started getting all clingy. When she broke up with me, I just couldn't let it go as us DPers have a problem of living in the past. Then she started dating a guy who was a friend of mine, but she was still calling me all the time, and we would still hook up every now and then, which was wrong. But, the whole time she was dating this other guy, she would tell me how she wanted to dump her boyfriend and get back together with me. So, I was confused as hell, still hooking up with her as much as her boyfriend did, but she never dumped this guy, so I finally told her to tell me to f*ck off and leave me alone, but she wouldn't. Eventually I said screw it, and she shortly thereafter dumped this guy.

Well, a few months later, she started dating my best friend and roommate, which royally pissed me off. Not just the fact that he was my roommate but he is a guy never to have been known for his looks, kind of fat, and he had a coke problem taboot. And she had this sweet, innocent persona, so the whole thing was shocking to everyone. I told them if they were going to date, never to come by our house, but they got lazy, and after a while I would hear them having sex through our paper thin walls. I finally just told myself, "this girl sucks," and after a while all the truth about her cheating on all her boyfriends came out and everyone found out what a manipulative whore she had been, with me and both her other boyfriends, and her life was ruined.

So yes, love and DP can be a bitch.

And interestingly enough, I had a sexual dream about her last night.

 

[Guest]

I think DP and this whole obsessing-over-a-single-girl type thing may be related. I've had my own experience, and since its end I have always sought to explain why it's happened at all.

My hypothesis is this. When you have DP, you always feel lonely, but having someone so close to you, so near the real you, which even you yourself are hidden from, this kills the loneliness in a thrill of utter excitement. If someone can emote for you, they most certainly can see something in you, something you don't even recognize yourself. And you want to see it too, so you continue with that person and develop an overwhelming emotional attachment to that person. So when it all comes down, the girl you've obsessed over actually in your mind embodies the entire concept of no longer having to be alone, embodies essentially an assumptive cure for DP. So you continue to feel extremely lonely after it all ends, because you were so close to helping yourself out of the gutter, but still so far. If things had gone the way you desired, you wouldn't be so alone anymore, and you could feel happy again, more of yourself (or more likely who you used to be, or likely who you remember yourself to be) in a way. And every time you think of the girl, you'll think of the cure you couldn't touch. And every time you think of not having to be lonely again, you think of the girl. It's a vicious cycle.

 

[person3]

Jason-
It doesn't make you disgusting, unless you're lying about your mom's hotness and she's really a crankhead with two teeth left

hm

sc-
I think your refusal to see Lin "as is" and weakness for her is a huge part of what could be giving you dp, but it's most likely not about Lin. I was reading "self analysis" by karen horney today, and i read a case study of a relationship that went exactly like that but after a very intense analysis the patient discovered a) her dependence on her husband was actually a neurotic dependence far from the concept of acutal "love" and b) though she was so "smitten" (or thought she was) by and dependent on her husband, she couldn't see that she actually didn't like him much at all, much less love him. You are playing with illusions here. And it's not Lin that wants you to buy into it...it's something far deeper than that. Lovers make good distractions when there could be a problem much farther back in life. And sometimes you will drop everything for your "lover", as he/she is the shield you're using to ignore the real problems.

 

[Martinelv]

I don't know if this is appropriate to this thread, but after listing the women that I've slept with/had relationships with, I've come to the conclusion that I am currently on speaking terms with the grand total of 1 of them ! Or rather, 1 of them doesn't hate me. What that says about me I don't know.

 

[sebastian]

I was reading "self analysis" by karen horney today, and i read a case study of a relationship...

uhh...huh huh...her name is karen horney... :lol:

Musashi: I think you may be onto something here. I think it's a combination of that and an ego thing though, because i've been on the other side of the stick before, doing the breaking up, and i've felt next to no longing afterwards. Although, with others, i've broken up (or allowed the relationship to deteriorate to such a point where i might as well have broken up), and afterwards regretted it. But nothing to this extent.

I definitely think you're onto something with this hypothesis though, musashi.

s.

 

[Guest]

Wow, Jason, that's really disturbing, but I guess I understand. I haven't ever been in a real relationship. But I find I can fall instantly 'in love' with any moderately attractive woman who shows me the least amount of attention. I think Musashi brought up an interesting point. I'm so lonely, I only have half a self so I want a woman to 'see something in me' to make me feel 'wanted' or 'real.' So apparently I had trouble growing up, and I never really developed a sense of being wanted or loved. So now I am quite lonely and needy in a way that makes me ashamed but also causes me to push women away from me. I fear I may come across as either pitiful or cold. Therapy hasn't helped yet. Nothing has.

Marty, poor Marty. Ah, well, nobody's perfect.

Also, I must admit to chronic masturbation and the frequent use of pornographic magazines.

 

[sleepingbeauty]

my ex bf used to screw his mother. but it wasnt consentual and the state ended up taking him away from her sickass.

 

[Guest]

Martin all this means according to the latest theories about male/female relationships is "they are simply not into you",ok so I've reversed it.

As for Ms Horney I think she has some interesting things to say about relationships.
As far as I understand one of her popular theories is that we are looking for either our mother(men)or father(females) to fill the actual void we felt in our parental relationships as children.Those old unmet needs again.
Sorry I don't know how this works in gay relationships,I guess it's the traits that count not the gender :?:
It's obvious to many women(not at all to others) that they tend to go for the same type of guy time and time again.
Time and time again they are dissapointed because he did not fulfill their needs just like Daddy didn't.

If Dad was cold,distant and unavailable(common traits),sure as eggs the radar zooms about and out of a couple of million men,she will manage to find him.......yep Mr cold,distant and unavailable.
Now the hard work begins,he must change.He must become the warm,caring,available man of our dreams so then we can feel whole and happy.
Problem is these buggers don't take to being changed easily so when the penny eventually drops it's onto the next renovation rescue.

I'm no expert but I think Karen Horney's concepts go something along these lines.
Naturally some people are more stubborn and hang in longer or perhaps their need or conviction that they can make it right is greater.

One thing I can say is that it was a very scary day when I realised that he is not going to change just because I asked nicely and then when that didn't work,threatened,yelled and manipulated.A very scary day when I realised it really is warts and all baby.
:shock: