What Cured You? (Advice for Beginners)

4061 Views 80 Replies 10 Participants Last post by Diamondarmorboy, 1 mo ago

Tres

Discussion Starter · 6 mo ago

Hello,

I wanted to see if maybe some people who have lessened or cured their depersonalization/derealization disorder could write their short list of what helps and what didn't help so that people who are looking for answers could avoid the lengthy conversations, arguments, and so on and instead just get good solid advice.

I appreciate you all and hope you all reach repersonalization soon!

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NoDevils

· #6 · 6 mo ago

Tres said:
Hello CoolWhip27,

So for clarification, for you, the answer that cured or lessened your dpd/drd is to accept it that it is happening and reframe it?

He believes acceptance is something you do without intention. By trying to solve the depersonalization (trying is a type of intention) you're not accepting it. Some people try to put this advice behind a paywall but it deserves to be free.

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NoDevils

· #9 · 6 mo ago (Edited)

According to the American Psychiatric Association Depersonalization Disorder is only supposed to be diagnosed when no other disorders are present. When depersonalization is secondary to a psychological or physical cause it can be called depersonalization syndrome or depersonalization for short. The APA have continuously flirted with calling it depersonalization-derealization disorder, as it's currently called in the latest edition of the DSM. Depersonalization Disorder has no officially approved treatments. All treatments are off-label or experimental. For this reason it can be said no official treatment for Depersonalization Disorder exists. Coolwhips's advice, however he arrived at his conclusion, is the best because it's the most realistic and current.

As for comorbid disorders, which may be primary causes of depersonalization in many cases, these often require intervention. For example if a patient has depersonalization as a consequence of using marijuana or suffering from panic attacks these are problems which can be addressed. Many sufferers fall into the trap of ignoring their comorbid problems because they're hopelessly obsessed with their symptoms and anxious rumination.

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NoDevils

· #15 · 6 mo ago (Edited)

Rationale or "concepts" are critically important. Without it we're just wandering through the dark. Ability to articulate concepts is also important. If some user of this forum has a genuine cure to depersonalization which doesn't fit under the categories of wellness advice, philosophy, or resolving some health problem which the depersonalization is secondary to then they're probably the first in history and should consider getting a patent.

Insisting on packaging the concept of acceptance in Zen buddhism is kind of silly but it's one of the better things happening on this forum.

You can tell the veterans from the noobs by how much they obsess over symptoms and try to manifest a pharmacological solution through sheer frustration. Some people after decades of this syndrome are still noobs. Tres and Coolwhip, you two are fortunate you've found acceptance and coping skills while retaining a willingness to improve your lives.

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NoDevils

· #22 · 6 mo ago (Edited)

Acceptance is a legitimate and empirically testable method of dealing with psychic misery. There are some problems of subjectivity such as the placebo effect but that's true of all studies which measure their success based on self-reported levels of misery. Acceptance shouldn't be a difficult or nebulous concept. I think that's just the direction your conversation is going.

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NoDevils

· #24 · 6 mo ago

coolwhip27 said:
And it can really only be realized in the realm of personal experience. I’m not sure what Tres has put together about what I said at all, besides him thinking I’m putting forth an “abstract concept”. Acceptance means everything you’ve been doing that makes you miserable coming to a complete stop. It’s only logical that chronic depersonalization is a result of chronic effort to escape “what is”. Acceptance of what is is not dependent on any circumstance, there is only peace with now. None of what I’m saying is even original, tres probably doesn’t even know that. He’s looking at what I’m saying and going “what?” and calling it abstract. Lol

I agree with Tres that acceptance is a non-treatment. A therapy designed to promote acceptance could be a treatment. Psychotherapeutic, nutritional, or even medical intervention might be necessary in many depersonalized people. These interventions should be undertaken to promote wellness rather than cure depersonalization. Depersonalization itself is pretty much harmless except the inattentiveness that can accompany it can be harmful. Depersonalization has also been linked to more severe presentations of mental illness, and suicide, though I don't believe depersonalization in itself warrants low quality of life or suicide.

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NoDevils

· #26 · 6 mo ago

coolwhip27 said:
It is a non treatment, because nobody can help you with it. But I’m of the opinion that when it comes to DP, any “treatment” is futile. I’m sure not every case of depersonalization is exactly the same, some may actually need guidance but for those who experience chronic stress as a result of themselves and experience DP then theyre going to have to help themselves.

I don't take a black/white position on this. I agree we can't force people into acceptance but we can promote and facilitate it. And we shouldn't completely forget the people who have mental illness because their lives are dire or the people who have depersonalization as a result of a physical health problem. Like you suggested before, depersonalization in this case can be an indicator that some change is needed.

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NoDevils

· #28 · 6 mo ago

coolwhip27 said:
Promote and facilitate is what I do. But there’s no going inside someone else’s mind and helping them, “acceptance” is completely on the individual. There’s no manual book given to anyone on how to operate themselves. Perhaps simple truths like that help embellish footprints for an individual to start learning more about themselves and the nature of suffering.

I think I agree. Everyone ultimately has sovereignty over themselves and we can only guess what's going on in their mind.

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NoDevils

· #68 · 6 mo ago (Edited)

We should stop having ego battles. Sascha and Peter have already said everything they have after their first comments and proceed to bicker like hens. We seem to be doing that a lot. Unfortunately naltrexone and lamotrigine are perhaps even more bunk in terms of treating depersonalization than psychoanalysis but you and your treatment providers are welcome to try. I'd never stop someone from trialing these medications considering the nescient and neglected, almost nonexistent state of depersonalization treatment.

Saschasascha said:
He has a treatment approach. It is mentioned several times in the book.
It is indeed pointless to argue with you. I actually feel sorry for you and your close-mindedness.
And no: It isnt the old "just live life and accept it". It is an acceptance and commitment approach that fosters emotional reactions and connections. In real life. Ever heard of that?

Sascha, it's very possible to heal in the presence of woo woo and sugar pills. Healthy people have a way of sorting their problems and healing themselves provided they have social support and aren't dealing with some fatal illness. Sometimes psychotherapies are a combination of woo woo and real, like how EMDR is a combination of hypnosis and reexperiencing therapy. Interestingly, hypnosis has been proven to work via suggestion, so it's like woo woo that can work.

Acceptance and trying to live a healthier life is a pragmatic move considering the borderline nonexistent state of depersonalization treatment, as I mentioned above. Taking part in trials can also be good so long as they're not overextending or harming you in any way.

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NoDevils

· #69 · 6 mo ago (Edited)

leminaseri said:
i believe saschasascha. there are a lot of recovered people (duration of 20+ years) ive talked with and all of them said things that could be correlated with that affect-theory. most of the people who recover do connect to their affect intuitively i think.

most of you wont know, but there used to be a german dp-forum. the admin of that group was a woman who suffered more than 20 years from complete blank mind (she claimed to not have been able to recall the abc) and she made a perfect degree in law after that with an age more than 50. for me, to say that this just is spontaneous recovery or „luck“ is the biggest disrespect someone can do. and to be honest, if i listen to such stories, i really dont give a fuck about my symptoms because the only thing i think then is „what am i lacking?“. nothing.

I think everyone who says they have a blank mind is a little bit of a goofball and could become a lawyer if they made a commitment and gave themselves an adequate timeframe. People with mental illness need perhaps more time to complete things. I believe this pseudo or exaggerated disability is especially true in people who make blank mind part of their identity for decades. Maybe I'm an asshole in this regard.

I had a phobia since my nervous breakdown that I couldn't do math. I had always done math in a conscious manner. Now I do math in an autopilot manner like everything else. People have phobias of academia or certain subjects and depersonalization fortifies it. The depersonalized people who say they can't go outside or do anything, they probably shouldn't operate machinery, but beyond that they're most likely capable and are merely having agoraphobia or something like that. The depersonalization makes them feel like their brain is crippled but it's not.

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NoDevils

· #73 · 6 mo ago (Edited)

@Peter

I never said you should respect Sascha for being recovered compared to you or me. While we're on the subject of respect you should give everyone the bare minimum of respect because that's the proper way to behave in society.

You're the one involved in most of the bickering and most prolific at it. I hope you put this much energy into improving your life and set a better example on DPSH in the future. It doesn't make sense to say we want depersonalization to be taken seriously and then behave like a turdsack. You're not oppressed in the conventional sense of the word. Far as mentally ill being oppressed you keep drawing all of these arbitrary distinctions between you and your fellow sufferers so you can be cuntish to them.

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NoDevils

· #74 · 6 mo ago

Trith said:
I am not exempt of a bigger than average ego myself, I think. I'm trying my best to not vomit it on people, but sometimes I am really ashamed of my own thinking. I don't know if it is the same on other forums, but maybe there is something with DPDR and being super invested in thoughts?

I don't know how to measure an ego, only when one is getting on my nerves. Everyone is different and gets triggered by different things. Peter thinks he's oppressed and that many of his fellow sufferers are accidentally in on it because they're stupid.

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NoDevils

· #75 · 6 mo ago (Edited)

About EMDR, I don't know how to describe it other than a reexperiencing therapy. I guess that's what you meant by exposition. It has other elements that remind me of hypnosis such as the eye movement, happy or safe imaginary place, and objective to put you in a trance. The alternative might be simple reexperiencing therapy performed with a tape recorder, which is scary for some people. The thought of going through another psychotherapy modality or dealing with another quack is scary to me. So is the notion of inducing a flashback on purpose. Maybe the fluff of EMDR is meant to blunt the flashback.

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