[Tres]

Hello,

I wanted to see if maybe some people who have lessened or cured their depersonalization/derealization disorder could write their short list of what helps and what didn't help so that people who are looking for answers could avoid the lengthy conversations, arguments, and so on and instead just get good solid advice.

I appreciate you all and hope you all reach repersonalization soon!

 

[coolwhip27]

Not seeking a cure, as if its something outside myself. I am my suffering and I am my good feeling. Yeah depersonalization is very real, no I’m not saying all you have to do is stop thinking about it. But people are interested in this, treating it like a study, thinking they’ll discover something they haven’t yet. Good feeling won’t come into fruition that way. The “cure” is literally within you, as cliche as it sounds. But you want something permanent, rock solid, which may look like a perfect explanation. That’s a never ending search and you’ll only be satisfied with an answer until you decide you are, so if your intelligent you’ll throw all that away. People have looked everywhere outward for solutions, from medications to dietary research, to studying other peoples methods. A waste of time no doubt. As far as im concerned, fuck this forum and all its useless debates. There’s no real debate, if you have depersonalization you need your own insight. What are you trying to solve? Problems are to be solved, but what do you do when YOU are the problem? Go on, find out. Or else just keep on the same direction which is the same thing keeping you insane.

I’m on this forum to try help, so before some ass tries to point a finger at me and call me a hypocrite because I’m on this forum, they can read and weep.

 

[Tres]

Not seeking a cure, as if its something outside myself. I am my suffering and I am my good feeling. Yeah depersonalization is very real, no I’m not saying all you have to do is stop thinking about it. But people are interested in this, treating it like a study, thinking they’ll discover something they haven’t yet. Good feeling won’t come into fruition that way. The “cure” is literally within you, as cliche as it sounds. But you want something permanent, rock solid, which may look like a perfect explanation. That’s a never ending search and you’ll only be satisfied with an answer until you decide you are, so if your intelligent you’ll throw all that away. People have looked everywhere outward for solutions, from medications to dietary research, to studying other peoples methods. A waste of time no doubt. As far as im concerned, fuck this forum and all its useless debates. There’s no real debate, if you have depersonalization you need your own insight. What are you trying to solve? Problems are to be solved, but what do you do when YOU are the problem? Go on, find out. Or else just keep on the same direction which is the same thing keeping you insane.

I’m on this forum to try help, so before some ass tries to point a finger at me and call me a hypocrite because I’m on this forum, they can read and weep.

Hello CoolWhip27,

So for clarification, for you, the answer that cured or lessened your dpd/drd is to accept it that it is happening and reframe it?

 

[coolwhip27]

Hello CoolWhip27,

So for clarification, for you, the answer that cured or lessened your dpd/drd is to accept it that it is happening and reframe it?

No, there’s no answer. See look, you want to put it in a box. That’s apart of the disorder. Your desire to frame some kind of an answer, reducing it to a description like “acceptance”. You can’t actually reduce it to being anything, when you’re feeling good you’ll find it wasn’t because of any explanation or method that you committed to

 

[Tres]

No, there’s no answer. See look, you want to put it in a box. That’s apart of the disorder. Your desire to frame some kind of an answer, reducing it to a description like “acceptance”. You can’t actually reduce it to being anything, when you’re feeling good you’ll find it wasn’t because of any explanation or method that you committed to

Hello,

If people develop dpd/drd and get better from it how, in your mind, is there no solution? I've been hearing this on the forums and I really don't understand this perspective.

 

[NoDevils]

Hello CoolWhip27,

So for clarification, for you, the answer that cured or lessened your dpd/drd is to accept it that it is happening and reframe it?

He believes acceptance is something you do without intention. By trying to solve the depersonalization (trying is a type of intention) you're not accepting it. Some people try to put this advice behind a paywall but it deserves to be free.

 

[Tres]

He believes acceptance is something you do without intention. By trying to solve the depersonalization (trying is a type of intention) you're not accepting it. Some people try to put this advice behind a paywall but it deserves to be free.

Hello NoDevils,

Okay, I see. CoolWhip27 is this a theory you've come up with or is there some sort of literature you've read this in? I'm only asking because from what i've understood acceptance and the solution of any mental health disorder have always been separate but both important for recovery.

 

[coolwhip27]

Hello NoDevils,

Okay, I see. CoolWhip27 is this a theory you've come up with or is there some sort of literature you've read this in? I'm only asking because from what i've understood acceptance and the solution of any mental health disorder have always been separate but both important for recovery.

A theory? I didn’t say there wasn’t a solution but does the solution identify as an answer? Logically it can’t, it must be bigger than an idea. I’m talking about the direction your mind is taking, which is you. Yes you can cure yourself but not through a methodology that you attempt to follow, then you’re still seeking something beyond yourself. Ok, look, there’s a good state and a bad state. If as you are in this bad state you are looking for a way out of it then naturally what do you do? This bad state is perpetuated by all the resistance to it, the seeking an answer etc. So if you actually saw that the direction you’re taking and the problem are one then why wouldn’t all effort cease? It would be automatic, instant, your mind sees the disorder that it’s been perpetuating and naturally comes to a stop

 

[NoDevils]

According to the American Psychiatric Association Depersonalization Disorder is only supposed to be diagnosed when no other disorders are present. When depersonalization is secondary to a psychological or physical cause it can be called depersonalization syndrome or depersonalization for short. The APA have continuously flirted with calling it depersonalization-derealization disorder, as it's currently called in the latest edition of the DSM. Depersonalization Disorder has no officially approved treatments. All treatments are off-label or experimental. For this reason it can be said no official treatment for Depersonalization Disorder exists. Coolwhips's advice, however he arrived at his conclusion, is the best because it's the most realistic and current.

As for comorbid disorders, which may be primary causes of depersonalization in many cases, these often require intervention. For example if a patient has depersonalization as a consequence of using marijuana or suffering from panic attacks these are problems which can be addressed. Many sufferers fall into the trap of ignoring their comorbid problems because they're hopelessly obsessed with their symptoms and anxious rumination.

 

[coolwhip27]

Coolwhips's advice, however he arrived at his conclusion, is the best because it's the most realistic and current.

From years of suffering and having enough of my own shit. I’m 24 years old but I feel like I’ve gone through hell and back about 8 thousand times. I know how bad this shit can get.

 

[Tres]

A theory? I didn’t say there wasn’t a solution but does the solution identify as an answer? Logically it can’t, it must be bigger than an idea. I’m talking about the direction your mind is taking, which is you. Yes you can cure yourself but not through a methodology that you attempt to follow, then you’re still seeking something beyond yourself. Ok, look, there’s a good state and a bad state. If as you are in this bad state you are looking for a way out of it then naturally what do you do? This bad state is perpetuated by all the resistance to it, the seeking an answer etc. So if you actually saw that the direction you’re taking and the problem are one then why wouldn’t all effort cease? It would be automatic, instant, your mind sees the disorder that it’s been perpetuating and naturally comes to a stop

Hello,

Yeah, a solution is synonymous with the answer in the case of the question i'm posing.

And yes, i'm assuming your response was a theory. Or really more of a hypothesis since it's untested (unless you've seen a research paper involving the concept of acceptance in depersonalization). It's an interesting hypothesis conceptually, I just don't see a way to prove it or how it explains a causal mechanism.

I appreciate your input sincerely. Personally I am on the other end of the spectrum looking at dpd/drd as a mostly biological. However I also believe in "whatever works".

 

[coolwhip27]

Hello,

Yeah, a solution is synonymous with the answer in the case of the question i'm posing.

And yes, i'm assuming your response was a theory. Or really more of a hypothesis since it's untested (unless you've seen a research paper involving the concept of acceptance in depersonalization). It's an interesting hypothesis conceptually, I just don't see a way to prove it or how it explains a causal mechanism.

I appreciate your input sincerely. Personally I am on the other end of the spectrum looking at dpd/drd as a mostly biological. However I also believe in "whatever works".

Heard and understood. If it’s conceptual understandings you’re after, then I’m afraid we can’t go any further. Because what I’m trying to get across is not a concept. I wish you the best of luck

 

[Tres]

Heard and understood. If it’s conceptual understandings you’re after, then I’m afraid we can’t go any further. Because what I’m trying to get across is not a concept. I wish you the best of luck

Hello CoolWhip27,

I am just looking for beneficial fact-based treatment approaches (regardless of methodology) presented in a clear and concise format that "veteran" users can impart onto "beginners".
What you presented is a concept. I wasn't really looking for concepts or "conceptual understandings" as you put it but I greatly appreciate your perspective and willingness to share.
I tend to shy away from the spiritual, philosophical, and conceptual myself because I am all about cold hard, peer-reviewed facts from reputable sources however I know some people don't respond to that for various reasons.
Anyways, I too wish you the best man and hope that your advice helps someone out there.

 

[coolwhip27]

Hello CoolWhip27,

I am just looking for beneficial fact-based treatment approaches (regardless of methodology) presented in a clear and concise format that "veteran" users can impart onto "beginners".
What you presented is a concept. I wasn't really looking for concepts or "conceptual understandings" as you put it but I greatly appreciate your perspective and willingness to share.
I tend to shy away from the spiritual, philosophical, and conceptual myself because I am all about cold hard, peer-reviewed facts from reputable sources however I know some people don't respond to that for various reasons.
Anyways, I too wish you the best man and hope that your advice helps someone out there.

So you’re really gonna try to assert over me, that what I personally know as a fact is conceptual? The whole point I make revolves around NOT being able to put the “cure” into a box, otherwise it becomes merely a concept. This is what you and most others here try do. Like I said, good LUCK with that.

I wonder if you are aware that anything thought puts together is a concept. You won’t be able to puncture the core of suffering with any idea, because thought will always be limited. See the fact of that, don’t interpret it according to your various beliefs you’ve accumulated. And don’t compare me as I say it, as if this is my idea I’ve thought of.

 

[NoDevils]

Rationale or "concepts" are critically important. Without it we're just wandering through the dark. Ability to articulate concepts is also important. If some user of this forum has a genuine cure to depersonalization which doesn't fit under the categories of wellness advice, philosophy, or resolving some health problem which the depersonalization is secondary to then they're probably the first in history and should consider getting a patent.

Insisting on packaging the concept of acceptance in Zen buddhism is kind of silly but it's one of the better things happening on this forum.

You can tell the veterans from the noobs by how much they obsess over symptoms and try to manifest a pharmacological solution through sheer frustration. Some people after decades of this syndrome are still noobs. Tres and Coolwhip, you two are fortunate you've found acceptance and coping skills while retaining a willingness to improve your lives.

 

[coolwhip27]

Rationale or "concepts" are critically important. Without it we're just wandering through the dark. Ability to articulate concepts is also important. If some user of this forum has a genuine cure to depersonalization which doesn't fit under the categories of wellness advice, philosophy, or resolving some health problem the depersonalization is secondary to then they're the first in history and should maybe go get a patent.

Insisting on packaging the concept of acceptance in Zen buddhism is kind of silly but it's one of the better things happening on this forum.

You can tell the veterans from the noobs by how much they obsess over symptoms and try to manifest a pharmacological solution through sheer frustration. Some people after decades of this syndrome are still noobs.

You can fit just about anything into a category. Technically everything we’re saying can be viewed as conceptual, but what I’m saying is there’s a difference between interpreting an idea (concept) and looking at an actuality (fact). If you’re seeing actuality then it doesn’t need to be analyzed and tested, you know it because it’s a fact. Thought is the enemy in depersonalization, it creates constant strain and effort to try overcome. The same mechanical condition which “Zen Buddhists” speak out against is the reason people have DP. DP is just a symptom of the broken human condition except exaggerated to the point of detachment, but it’s the same thing. It may also happen to be that people who come here are simply just more obsessed than others who suffer from the same thing, which is also a byproduct of all this

 

[Tres]

Hello CoolWhip27,

An "actuality" should be able to be analyzed and tested to confirm it's a fact. That's the scientific method. Otherwise it's just speculation; a hypothesis. Thesis meaning "a statement or theory that is put forward as a premise to be maintained or proved" and hypo meaning "below or less than". In the case of "hypothesis" it means a statement that is made that has yet to be proven through scientific method.

 

[Tres]

Hello CoolWhip27,

I wonder how you can be so oppositional to the cure/solution approach when it works for so many, myself included. I never cared much for the psychological aspect and completely neglected it in my recovery and yet i'm out.
I prefer again, to build on evidence-based solutions rather than discredit any solution. I don't see why you feel that both concepts can't exist as solutions.

 

[Tres]

Hello CoolWhip27,

I understand the point you're making and don't really understand why you are hyper-fixated on me referring to your hypothesis/concept as such.
But yes, my goal was to put the solution into a box. Because it worked for me and my clients. I again, don't understand why you feel that the solution I've seen work time and time again infringes on your worldview so much that you fee the need to be bitter about it. I'm not discrediting your solution (or anti-solution?) despite it not being testable.

Similarly to you saying there are others like me on this site putting solutions into boxes so too are there people like you who attempt to conflate and abstract the concept of curing themselves into this intangible, philosophical knot.

 

[coolwhip27]

Hello CoolWhip27,

An "actuality" should be able to be analyzed and tested to confirm it's a fact. That's the scientific method. Otherwise it's just speculation; a hypothesis. Thesis meaning "a statement or theory that is put forward as a premise to be maintained or proved" and hypo meaning "below or less than". In the case of "hypothesis" it means a statement that is made that has yet to be proven through scientific method.

Well, you’ve mixed up and diluted what I wanted to share with all sorts of definitions. The scientific method has nothing to do with it, if analysis is involved then you’d be analyzing yourself which would be absurd. Intangible philosophical knot is what you’ve made it out to be. That’s because we aren’t meeting together as we talk about this, so I’d prefer we both leave it alone for now.