[Guest]

So yesterday and this morning I was frantically looking for reassurance that my "paranoid" thoughts are ok, that other people experience them as well etc. (I posted about this under a different topic).

Then, I got a response from Janine and G-Funk that had an impact of a lightning bolt. "Trust yourself".... both of them pointed out that I'm constantly checking and self-monitoring by looking for reassurance... that's not acceptance... you have to trust yourself with this condition....

Also, I realized that in my DP/DR-free moments, what I experienced under DR/DP was still here... meaning, this IS reality.. just laced with fear.... this IS me... just laced with fear. A part of me expected some huge breakthrough from one state to the other but in reality, everything "appeared the same", just calm and rational... in a way.

I posted about this before elsewhere but I just have to say that Janine and G-Funk, you guys shocked me with this insight. I have to trust myself, grow confident in who I am and be spontaneous and true to myself and maybe I will have a shot at recovery from this annoying thing.

 

[Guest]

Yep, you got it.

And just to add one thing:
We sort of "split ourselves" in two during those bad states. We do NOT trust ourselves at all, at least not trust ourselves as a regular normal human being.

We DO trust our "observer" self to watch out and judge our every thought and feeling. We invest TOO much "trust" in the guard part of ourselves..as if that wild and dangerous human that we are MUST be watched constantly or "it" will go berzerk.

We need to stop watching ourselves live.

We need to stop watching ourselves think.

And then one day, we turn around and say "wow....it's been so long....since I thought that way..."

To badly paraphrase a great Carl Sandburg poem: recovery is not a thunder of hooves in the night.
Recovery comes in on little quiet cat feet.

One gentle step at a time....

peace,
J

 

[Guest]

damn janine, you are great!

 

[Guest]

Yes, she is! I'm literally in tears since I reached this huge enlighment with Janine's help and then this evening, someone's criticism of me scared me and was almost pushing me down into deeper DP/DR but then I told myself that I'll trust myself and trust in my recovery and live no matter what and ....well, Janine....what can I say? You're a savior...I freaked out for an hour as opposed to days or weeks that I thought it would take.... thank you=)

Once again, there is no great barrier to cross.. this IS reality and this IS the self... it's just clouded by fears and lack of belief.....

 

[g-funk]

Wow you catch you on quick Tidal! Janine, looks like you have another convert!

Funnily enough, I had some thoughts this afternoon related to this topic. I have really got stuck into living recently, loving the simple fact I can just sit and watch tv and relax, or go out to a party and have fun all night. I would say there are days when dp or related obsessions haven't even crossed my mind, other than when I take my tablet or log on to read the stuff in this website. When reading Tidal's realisation of insights etc, and remembered how I felt when Janine would say something that just clicked etc and that feeling of really being in touch with yourself and generally 'being good' to yourself, its so hard to describe. I suddenly felt like whilst I was running around like a blue-arsed fly doing this, doing that, going here and there, I felt a little bit I was out of touch with myself. Realising this was a good thing, bit like I need to take time out to - but this is the question - self-monitor? I almost felt that whilst I wasn't doing any self discovery, although totally un-dp'd - I was getting caught up again in bad patterns.
For instance, I was reading that Abstract that RevSarah posted and the bit which describes how DP is rarely treated successfully with drugs etc and it is normally chronic etc I had a wave of, not exactly fear, but those old feelings of when you first learn what it is and how 'doomed' you are. Then I had to remind myself of something that I had learnt recently - that I am not like everyone else, and infact we are all unique, we all have different symptoms and different problems, 'treat the person not the disease' type thing. And I think that the doom and gloom that surrounds DP, especially for those of us with weak self image, are maybe held back by the thought that if no-one else can get better, then you definitely can't. Also, ironically, it seems that in order to be able to take on board any constructive help or therapy, you have to remember that you ARE like anybody else, in that you're case is no more special or complicated and that you are not immune to help. I think that magical thinking and 'feeling special' contributes to this. I know it sounds like I have contradicted myself here, I am rambling a bit and gone off topic...

The point I was making was, I felt as though I had not spent enough time learning about myself and had forgotten the tools of the trade so to speak, as I had not given myself enough time to get to grips with them, despite the fact I have been much happier lately. I guess the compromise is between these too, until they both become a way of life. Right now, I sometimes have to take a look around and stop for a minute and just feel like 'me' which is something I never really felt like before, and connecting with yourself feels very different to obsessive introspection.

Anyway, after these thoughts this afternoon, my brain was about to interpret this as a cue to return to self monitoring and emailing/pming/posting to achieve some form of reassurance that I was doing fine, just get on with it blah blah. But I've learnt enough to at least see that's where my brain wanted to go and I've called its bluff. I'm going to trust myself to do it.

I posted as I find it very cathartic as I was literally working out my feelings as I wrote this post, I had no idea that I would come to that conclusion when I started.

Any reassurance or opinions welcome

JOKE :lol:

 

[g-funk]

Actually, to summarise the above, unless I feel as though I am doing or thinking or being involved in DP discussion and understanding new ideas or insights, I am not in control of this thing. That is not to say all the things I learnt aren't brilliant, but at the end of the day, they do not change me, they change the way I respond to things and how I handle life, but are not to be abused as a form of crutch of reassurance. So I am not out of control when living my life and not spending all my time on dpselfhelp .com, I just have to remember to stay true to myself. Ignore me, just thinking out loud...

 

[Guest]

bit which describes how DP is rarely treated successfully with drugs etc and it is normally chronic etc I had a wave of, not exactly fear, but those old feelings of when you first learn what it is and how 'doomed' you are

(quote from G-funk above)

See, for me....those kinds of returning thoughts/fears usually indicated some other VERY normal, but troubling problem or fear in my life. It's too easy to accept our terrors at face value - to just say "Suddenly I'm petried again about being mentally ill all my life!" Look deeper (not into your phobic obsessions, but look into other areas in your current life).

Chances are good that the recent "oh, my GOD, we are all doomed!" phobia was re-ignited because it REPRESENTS another kind of fear. Getting ready to change jobs? Going back to school (I happen to know you are, I'm not psychic,lol)....maybe developing some fears about the world in general "oh, hell, I'm no kid anymore...the whole stupid world may blow itself up by the time I can start a new career...why am I even bothering with this school thing?"

NORMAL fears, normal concerns, normal insecurities....all dressed up in super-human clothes of dp and unreality and the abyss of No Self.

Make any sense?

Love ya,
J

 

[g-funk]

You know it makes sense... :lol:

So what you're saying is it's where one of my particular weaknesses/beliefs/patterns/conflicts (is there a collective word for these things? -how about issues?!?) is being tried again but in a different context - as of course life keeps changing. It is representing itself with a costume on? (I keep thinking about Dementors from Harry Potter when we talk about this kind of thing )

That 'part' of me or issue was just below the surface and reading that sentence triggered it, but the actual material had no direct releveance but triggered an emotional response that was linked kind of thing?!?!?!

 

[Guest]

Yep, you done got it (the Dementors, lol...I may "steal" that, lol)

Remember: symptoms are from a part of the mind that wants us to turn totally INWARD. It's not that the real life "issues" are WORSE (scarier) than the horrid dp, heavens no! They pale by comparison.

But the symptoms are not created in a better than/worse than comparison. Their"objective" is to turn your energies AWAY from the real world, away from Secondary Process experience...and to lure you INWARD, into a symbolic land of "as if" experiences.

It's as if your mind is saying "no, now now...let's not deal in Reality, okay? Close your eyes, feel the slumber...and I'll weave you a symbolic dream that will "address" those issues...but dont' trouble yourself with that nasty old scary reality place."

Love,
Hermoine
grin

 

[Guest]

God, how true!!!!

I am learning to just live and go through these DP/DR experiences without getting caught in their webs but a part of me is thinking that it's good that they showed up. The feeling of unreality is actually making me look closer at the "reality" I had before this nightmare. I think that I lived in a fantasy land looooong before DP/DR kicked in since I avoided dealing with things that bothered me.

Now maybe this will force me to face everything... and I mean, EVERYTHING.... without being able to escape it.

Janine, what you said in regard to someone else's post really stuck with me. How when you supress yourself, you alost seize to be....how true! I wasn't really myself 3 months ago before this condition happened to me. I was a depressed 25 year old grad student who didn't want to deal with her problems, with her boyfriend, with herself... who didn't know herself...

Now, this and your suggestions are giving me a chance to truly live and maybe for the first time truly love the life I have=)