[coolwhip27]

I understand that everyone here is in different stages of DP or whatever they go through. Everyone’s experience is unique and some are harder than others. I remember my mind being on fire, being in a much worse place than I am now. But I’ve realized now, the more I asked “how” the worse off I was. Think of it as a means to give up. A means to not see for yourself. Asking how is giving up. So, people turn to psychiatric help to seek an answer to the problem that they have about their mind or whatever it is. Depersonalization, ocd, irrational fear and anxiety etc.. But as soon as you make “it” a problem, you will be caught in the solution of it. You will be left seeking constantly for an answer. I’m preaching Jiddu krishnamurti here, but this is very important. This is more than just a simple truth, this is insight. I’m not just writing this for fun, I’m writing this for you. You have times of being at peace and times of suffering too. And as soon as you slip up, you start asking “how do I attain that peace again?” Picture yourself lost in a forest. For some people the forest is more intense. Giving up inside that forest is the equivalent of asking how. Once you ask how, you’ve trapped yourself in a search. Please understand this.

 

[Aridity]

The moment I tried to get better, I got worse and worse.

 

[ThoughtOnFire]

This is real talk. There hasn't been a single moment in 18+ years that I wasn't "trying to figure out" DP/DR, mentally. I've come up with hundreds of self thought up techniques and I always feel that I'm "close".

 

[Trith]

This is real talk. There hasn't been a single moment in 18+ years that I wasn't "trying to figure out" DP/DR, mentally. I've come up with hundreds of self thought up techniques and I always feel that I'm "close".

Absolutely, so much of this for me too. I think that figuring things out, or outsmarting problems has always been my strategy, perhaps even before DPDR to a certain extent. But when that strategy feeds DPDR itself my natural reflex was to try even more in that direction and push even harder. And then it can be difficult to tell the difference between good courage and detrimental obstination. And even trying to change strategy can turn into just another mental project with self thought up techniques and so on, fed by fantasies of recovery being very close. This is why I have an ambivalent / negative relationship with "hope". In the one hand it can be just thinking that there can be solutions and that I can keep going with serenity, and in the other hand hope can just keep feeding fantasies of recovery and of being just close to "mastering" the problem, which can feed an illusion of control and just encourage to keep pushing further without actually changing strategy.

In some tibetan buddhist stuff, they talk about six different "realms" that symbolize ways we perpetuate suffering. As much as I think tibetan buddhism is full of cult-like stuff, I still relate to this, but they are probably not the only ones to speak about this. One of these realms is the "god" realm, where we try to be kind of gods in our mind, or convince ourselfs we can become gods. By over-explaining stuff, by building an accurate model of the world, we try to achieve a state where we will never have negative surprises again and will kind of be in control of our life or a kind of safe space where we will never be wrong again. It feels like we are mastering stuff but actually they say it is like trapping ourselfs in a jail and just trying to make that jail bigger and bigger until it contains the whole world. And it feels to me this both describes some of the feelings of DR and at the same time that kind of implicit strategy that I have been using to get out of DR.

 

[ThoughtOnFire]

100% relate to that Trith

 

[coolwhip27]

This is real talk. There hasn't been a single moment in 18+ years that I wasn't "trying to figure out" DP/DR, mentally. I've come up with hundreds of self thought up techniques and I always feel that I'm "close".

Wow, I more than just relate to that, I FEEL what you just described deep down lol. The “coming up with hundreds of self thought up techniques and feeling like you’re close”. There’s great frustration there, because it’s a form of insanity. You can’t picture the problem and look at it because it’s not an idea, it’s a state of mind. So as much we’d like to, we can’t grasp the explanation. We just have to live it..

 

[coolwhip27]

Absolutely, so much of this for me too. I think that figuring things out, or outsmarting problems has always been my strategy, perhaps even before DPDR to a certain extent. But when that strategy feeds DPDR itself my natural reflex was to try even more in that direction and push even harder. And then it can be difficult to tell the difference between good courage and detrimental obstination. And even trying to change strategy can turn into just another mental project with self thought up techniques and so on, fed by fantasies of recovery being very close. This is why I have an ambivalent / negative relationship with "hope". In the one hand it can be just thinking that there can be solutions and that I can keep going with serenity, and in the other hand hope can just keep feeding fantasies of recovery and of being just close to "mastering" the problem, which can feed an illusion of control and just encourage to keep pushing further without actually changing strategy.

In some tibetan buddhist stuff, they talk about six different "realms" that symbolize ways we perpetuate suffering. As much as I think tibetan buddhism is full of cult-like stuff, I still relate to this, but they are probably not the only ones to speak about this. One of these realms is the "god" realm, where we try to be kind of gods in our mind, or convince ourselfs we can become gods. By over-explaining stuff, by building an accurate model of the world, we try to achieve a state where we will never have negative surprises again and will kind of be in control of our life or a kind of safe space where we will never be wrong again. It feels like we are mastering stuff but actually they say it is like trapping ourselfs in a jail and just trying to make that jail bigger and bigger until it contains the whole world. And it feels to me this both describes some of the feelings of DR and at the same time that kind of implicit strategy that I have been using to get out of DR.

There’s a very common theme that actually takes place within most of us here. We are all interested in this stuff or else we wouldn’t come back to talk about it. I want to say that we are deep thinkers. Not that we are smarter, but there is a deep yearning for something that might be impossible to attain. I think this yearning and brooding is a path we are choosing on purpose. Not depersonalization and disconnection from reality of course, but if brooding is apart of what makes it happen then what’s the difference? It’s apart of what keeps us from being all “la di da” I’m just living life and doing the same thing everyday. We would rather take the hard rewarding way out, like “I’m gonna figure it all out because fuck the daily robotic life a regular person lives. I’m getting to the bottom of it.” So, perhaps this is all apart of the “disorder”. We are choosing to think about it, and that’s ok!

And also, I’m sorry trith. Please forgive me for whatever negative things I’ve thrown your way. Life is hard, that’s all I can say..,

 

[ThoughtOnFire]

Well said! What I want to add to this on the top of my mind right now is that: I've always believed that if one only knew what to do, then it would be easy and perhaps instantaneous of a shift back to reality.

 

[coolwhip27]

Well said! What I want to add to this on the top of my mind right now is that: I've always believed that if one only knew what to do, then it would be easy and perhaps instantaneous of a shift back to reality.

I know. This is... what bugs me when I am suffering. Because I know the light is one step away in my mind..

with that being said, krishnamurti really IS right about attention being non duality in our minds..