[Homeskooled]

To all concerned,

I was reading some studies today and I thought I should bring some of them to light in the forum since so many people here are on antidepressants. In Italy last year, a study was conducted which concluded that the use of amphetamines, cocaine, or ecstasy could damage a person's DNA. In other words, they were at an increased risk of cancer. I've known this for a while. What I didn't know was that a Canadian study done in 2002 showed a direct link between increased breast cancer and the use of Paxil and Tricyclic medications, especially Anafranil. Prozac and Zoloft were shown to have no ill effects. In effect, these substances damage one's DNA in a similair fashion to street drugs.

Also, anyone on antipsychotics who is experiencing low blood sugar, please realize that it is more than likely from your medication. A bipolar friend of mine is having severe problems with hypoglycemia because of Geodone and Zyprexa. Her psychiatrist seems to think that she has Type 2 diabetes...I'm astounded by his ignorance. In closing, I dont mean to alarm anyone here, but I've meant to post some things to this effect for a while. You dont necessarily need to discontinue Paxil or Anafranil if you are on it, but taking an antioxidant wouldnt hurt either ( like vitamin C or E). In the end, its just best to be informed.

Peace
Homeskooled

 

[Guest]

so your saying me taking Paxil is damaging my DNA???

 

[Dreamer]

Homeskooled,
Do you have the titles, authors, journals for these studies? Are there abstracts on PubMed, etc.?

Thanks,
It's always something!
D :shock:

 

[dakotajo]

A while back I read an article in the New York times that claimed that the new anti-psychotics can possibly cause diabetes.

Joe

 

[Homeskooled]

Dear Dreamer,
Here is the info I have on the two studies. The Italian study was published in 2003 by Giorgio Bronzetti of the biochemistry department of the CNR, the Italian equivalent of the NIH. The second study done on antidepressants in Canada was done in 2002 and was published in the British Journal of Cancer, Jewish General Hospital, Montreal, American Journal of Epidemioligy. I also did a google search and found that the site Prozac Truth has several other studies relating to this topic. To be honest, I dont know what to think of this site's integrity, since it almost seems to me to be a front for selling glutathione. For that matter, I dont even know what the efficacy or uses of glutathione are. Let me know what you think.

The articles and papers they quote are: (1) Journal Clinical Epidemiology 1995 Nov;48(11) : 1407-12
(2) American Journal Epidemiology 1999 Oct 15;150 (8) :861-8
(3) Eur J. Surg Oncol 2001 Jun;27 (4) : 429-31
(4) Am J Epidemiology 2000 May 15;151 (10) ;951-7

As for diabetes, I beleive there are references in the PDR about atypical antipsychotics inducing diabetes, and I know that there are several class action lawsuits against the makers of Geodone and Seroquel for people with permanent pancreatic damage.

Peace
Homeskooled

 

[Homeskooled]

Dear Soulbro,
In response to your question, yes, I'm saying it COULD be damaging your DNA. I dont know how absolute this study was. It seems to be from a peer reviewed source. Its probably not the healthiest substance in the world to be ingesting, but then again, neither is red meat. Maybe Zoloft is a better alternative, or taking an antioxidant. I dont know what to think. I would think the FDA would have looked into these foreign studies by now, but sometimes, they are far behind the rest of the world.

Peace
Homeskooled

 

[Guest]

Homeskooled, are all trizyclics associated with DNA damage?

Does it have to do with dosage?

Was the study about breast cancer only or all types of cancer?

 

[Guest]

This is not good, I have enough shit to worry about, i don't need to be worrying that A MEDICINE THATS SUPPOSE TO HELP ME CAN POSSIBLY BE DAMAGING TO MY DNA AND EVEN CANCEROUS??????????!!!!! :shock:

Im trying to get myself healthy ( mentally) and i don't need to be worrying about future physical problems because of Paxil.

So more clarification on this matter would be appreciated.

 

[Dreamer]

Thanks HS,
Also SoulBro, I will look into this further, and have an appointment at the University of Michigan Neuropsych Department in November and will ask about this.

One thing. I have been on one med or another since 1974... yes, Nineteen seventy-four. I started with Imipramine (an old tricyclic). I'm currently on Celexa, Lamictal, Klonpin, and Notriptyline (another tricyclic).

I have a history of breast cancer -- my mother had it (was fine) and my Aunt had it (my mother's sister) and passed away from it in 1974.

I've got to tell you, I agree we have plenty to be concerned about re: ANY medication we take. I'm not thrilled to hear about Vioxx, etc.

For me, my combination is what keeps me from being completely non-functioning. And I feel to a great extent my life has been taken away from me by DP/DR. Again, for me, the BENEFIT outweighs the RISK for me. I have made this choice.

I see as I get older, I may not be able to tolerate all the meds I'm on. I'm troulbed by this, but I will be dealing with a readjustment of meds this Fall.

Don't drive yourself crazy about this. For me, and I speak only for myself, I wouldn't be here if it weren't for my meds combo, and at this late date I am afraid of changing it. For me, bad DP/DR is unbearable, and my chronic DP/DR enrages me, but these are the cards I was dealt.

And we can't jump to conclusions. Tricyclics and SRIs have been around for some time. I would think there would be more research into this (as there was into Vioxx, and a number of other meds recently).

I don't like the pharmaceutical companies, am pissed at psychiatrists, but I'd say, first focus on your present state -- getting better.

And if you're informed, you can decide.

I appreciate Homeskooled's research. Time will tell.

Also the term "changing one's DNA" -- that sounds rather dramatic. I think what Homeskooked means is that cancer cells mutate, and perhaps some psych drugs cause mutations in some people vs. others.

We have cancer cells in our bodies all the time. They come and go. Cells change and grow and our body destroys any "aberrant" cells -- this is very simple. I wouldn't worry about this now. We have no control over it. The choice is, if you wish to go Rx drug free, you can make an informed decision.

Take Care,
D
We really don't know the long-term effects of a lot of medications. For everyone, meds for arthritis pain, to heart medication, to migraine meds, etc., etc. can cause serious side effects. Again it is risk/benefit. Not a pleasant choice, but the one we have right now.

 

[Dreamer]

P.S.

Forgot to say, I read recently that antioxident supplements may help reduce the chance of cancer. However, eating a diet high in fruits and vegetables -- complex carbs may be more beneficial. That is the truly "natural" way of getting antioxidants into our bodies.

A healthy diet ... as healthy as possible, can never hurt, and can only help in the long run.

We also know the obvious -- that Rec drugs are obviously destructive, or have the potential to be so. The chance of that as far as I'm concerned is just as troubling, yet many here (and I make NO judgement) seem comfortable experimenting with these drugs. In the short run, and perhaps the long run, I'd say we know more about the certain danger of drugs such as Ecstasy for instance.

All we can do is stay as healthy as possible. Diet, exercise, quit smoking and experimenting with rec drugs.

 

[Guest]

this post is really making me want to get off Meds

 

[lone wolf]

I agree with SoulBrotha. Indeed every detailed information about meds damaging the person who is taking them makes me nervous. I stopped smoking cigarrettes for health risks, but I can't stop my meds that easily, at least while I'm studying, as I have to stay mentally healthy for uni. So I am going to take Zyprexa and Remeron for at least next two years' time, no matter what people say about brain damage and other health risks.

Actually, if these meds were too dangerous why anybody would be prescribing them to people in the first case? I hope five years' on Zyprexa ("the drug that causes brain damage and blah blah") and Remeron (I don't know yet its dangers, but there must be some too, if I guess right) won't cause future problems to my health. Indeed without those two meds I probably wouldn't be alive anymore - or would be permanently on the mental ward in the mildest case - so who cares if there are some risks.

I'm pretty sure not everyone taking antipsychotics will end up being brain damaged, nor everyone will develop cancer, even those who are smoking cigarrettes constantly. So I try to stay calm, while taking my daily meds... I have decided to stop my medication slowly after I have finished my studies, but meanwhile I need to be able to function. So I will take the meds, no matter what. :shock:

 

[lone wolf]

For me, my combination is what keeps me from being completely non-functioning. And I feel to a great extent my life has been taken away from me by DP/DR. Again, for me, the BENEFIT outweighs the RISK for me. I have made this choice.

Oh, Dreamer, you said The Thing it already while I was writing my previous post. I agree 100 %. Indeed reading your post made me feel not that nervous, as I see the question of risk vs. benefit too. Sometimes I just can't stand all the debate on the health risks caused by psychiatric meds, as I need to take my med combo for being able to function in this world at the moment.

 

[Guest]

Dreamer, how old are you?

 

[dakotajo]

I lost both my mental and physical health from psychiatric drugs. After coming off of them I had seizures, high blood pressure, blurry vision, and a ton of psychiatric problems . All of these problems are now gone but its taken 2 full years to recover. In my 20's I used my share of recreational substances and when I quit, I had only a slight rise in anxiety and no physical health problems. If I ever decide to take a drug again I think Ill stick with the recreational variety..lol

Joe

 

[gimpy34]

I recently read an article about ecstasy which listed some of the other ingredients sometimes put in ecstasy. We know MDMA, or "molly" is the pure form of ecstasy. I knew sometimes ecstasy manufacturers put bits of heroin, speed, ketamine, and miscellaneous stimulants. However, some of the less clean ecstasy can be a lot like methamphetamine, and can contain stuff like battery acid and floor cleaner. To think I used to take this stuff blows my mind.

 

[Dreamer]

Dreamer, how old are you?

Lord have mercy I will be 46 on 12/2!!!!

If anything, I am testament to the fact that the experimenting with meds over the years hasn't damaged my brain yet. EDIT: Note I have NEVER taken a rec drug in my life, except a bit of alcohol. Not even one toke of a joint.

I also get yearly liver function tests/actually full blook workups with my full physical. I get an EKG to be sure there is no heart damage. I have been doing fine. I also get very few side effects.

In the 1980s I briefly tried 2 anti-psychotics (Stellazine and something else). They made my DP/DR go through the roof. That, along with the fact that I'm most leery of neuroleptics, keeps me from looking into that option. I hope in time... perhaps not in my lifetime but for you younger folk here, there will be a drug or certain treatment for DP/DR.

Anyway, despite DP/DR, depression and anxiety (insidious in childhood) then chronic from late high-school onwards ... I have a BA and an MA, I have been able to work on and off, and am getting back into my mental health advocacy. I hope to speak about DP, and the misunderstandings about it, to a NAMI General Meeting at some point. Perhaps I can get Dr. Simeon to do the same at the next NAMI convention.

http://www.nami.org

At any rate, in 1975 when I was first put in Imipramine, I was 15 years old. I was alone/afraid, my mother was abusive and not supporting, my father wasn't there for me. I had no choices. Over the years I've learned as I've experienced the changes in the psychiatric system. There was no internet when I was 15 and my mother, a shrink, made me "keep my problems secret, even my parents' divorce." It's taken me a long time to have faith in my own decisions.

Have faith in yours.
And good for all who quit smoking, eat healthy, exercise (so hard for me). We control what we can control. What else can we do.

Best,
D

 

[lone wolf]

If I ever decide to take a drug again I think Ill stick with the recreational variety..lol

LOL Joe! :lol: Oh, I just have to admit I am one of those who use MDMA (Ecstasy), though just once a year. But I am much more worried about taking Zyprexa and Remeron than Ecstasy, as those first two drugs I have to take daily - compared to my MDMA use I guess it has much more impact to my health. I am not that worried about getting cancer by taking Ecstasy only once a year...

 

[Dreamer]

I recently read an article about ecstasy which listed some of the other ingredients sometimes put in ecstasy. We know MDMA, or "molly" is the pure form of ecstasy. I knew sometimes ecstasy manufacturers put bits of heroin, speed, ketamine, and miscellaneous stimulants. However, some of the less clean ecstasy can be a lot like methamphetamine, and can contain stuff like battery acid and floor cleaner. To think I used to take this stuff blows my mind.

Dear Gimpy,
Yup, this was happening back in the 1970s. My mother worked in a psych E.R. She'd be called in at 3am re: some patient that had symptoms all over the map and no one could figure them out. Schizophrenia? Psychotic episode of some kind? Seizures, etc. When they'd do a tox screen on the individual it would come back with street drugs cut with everything from FLOUR to Comet Cleanser.

The one good thing I can say is prescribed meds ARE screened by the FDA. At minimum, you know what you're getting. Again, the rest is out of one's control. And we all react differently.

Individuals with severely disabling IBS and arthritis want certain banned drugs BACK on the market. Without them, they can't function. And hopsitals are sort of dangerous places .. you can get a horrible infection just going in to have a broken leg taken care of.

I'm coming to some sense of peace knowing There are many things I CAN control, and many things I CAN'T control and I'll drive myself over the edge if I focus on the negative, which I do all the time anyway.

Best,
D

 

[Dreamer]

If I ever decide to take a drug again I think Ill stick with the recreational variety..lol

LOL Joe! :lol: Oh, I just have to admit I am one of those who use MDMA (Ecstasy), though just once a year. But I am much more worried about taking Zyprexa and Remeron than Ecstasy, as those first two drugs I have to take daily - compared to my MDMA use I guess it has much more impact to my health. I am not that worried about getting cancer by taking Ecstasy only once a year...

See, this astounds me. I suppose I wouldn't be worried about cancer from taking MDMA once a year, but I'd be terrified it would put me in an intolerable DP state. We know so many people here whose DP onset happened sometimes from chronic rec drug use, or other times from a one time use. The statistics of that, just from this board, seem to be rather high for those of predisposed to DP.

I just don't understand the willingness to take THAT risk. But again, that is a risk/benefit as is taking any other drug.

Again, no judgement. But I wouldn't touch a rec drug if you paid me a BILLION dollars. No lie.