[Guest]

Hey guys,

Just want to let you know that I've battled anxiety, panic disorder, and depression for a few years now. A few months ago, during a moment of high stress, I began to feel dp/dr, and since then it has not gone away, and is there 24/7. It is constant and unyielding, and sucks big time, however it is not the least of my worries. What sucks the most is this reoccuring thought that nothing is real. I freak myself out thinking that everything is a figment of my imagination, and this thought really, really scares me, even worse than dp/dr. With dp/dr things "feel" different, but I still know reality exists. Anyways, since I was a kid I had very philisophical thoughts, and was wondering if anyone had these thoughts of "what if nothing is real" (not b/c of dp/dr) If so, does anyone know why this might be such a deep seated fear of mine, and what it might relate to? Better yet, if anyone might know what this type of thought/fear falls under in a psychological context that would be great so I could do some additional research. The dp/dr was plenty bad enough, now I am consumed with the fear that nothing is real. I do not dig philosophy or new-age stuff. This fear of nothing being real has been with me for a long time, and now with everything else going on I am at my wit's end. For real :wink:

Thanks,

Jon

 

[Guest]

Well, first of all, you're in the right place. As far as believing that nothing is real, i am at fault of this. I think it can be totally different than derealization though. I have derealization bigtime, and its just a perception shift; my "reality" has changed. As far as asking the question "what if nothing is real"...i think that is a very enlightened philosophy on life and there is nothing wrong with that. I'm not sure if this is what you are feeling though. There is "reality" which you may or may not have lost, and there is reality which revolves around metaphysical potentialities and the nature of life in general.

I have not lost my "reality". I have acquired a new one. As far as reality; now thats a different mindfuck alltogether.

 

[Guest]

Ziggo,

The reality I'm talking about is different than dp/dr. I used to question the issue of reality years before I came down with dp/dr, but now for some reason (I know why) I've become paralyzed with the fear that nothing is real, and everything is part of my imagination. I'm wondering why I might have this fear/what it relates to. dp/dr might have set it off, but I know it is different. To me it's not some nice philosophical transient thought, but an almost compulsive fear, that is making me very scared.

Any other thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[Guest]

Well, that's the symptom. You are describing it very well...

see, I think of DP as in stages. There is the lower/less distressing level of dp as a 'bodily' unreality - as if I don't feel like ME, or feel I'm not awake, or not alive, etc.

But with more powerful obsessive types (like me) we reach another level of the experience where we literally come to have a paranoid delusion that NOTHING exists. It's a kind of "Wiping out the entire universe" experience.

I suffered that for years. I knew not to TELL people I truly believed the entire world was not real, because I knew it sounded insane. But I still believed it.

I thought I had invented everything, or was dreaming it...that the world/universe NEVER existed, and it was like The Truman Show or the Matrix....as if I had some special insight about the nature of existence and I had "woken up" to learn this horrible truth - that nothing ever really existed and the entire production was just a figment of my imagination.

Psychoanalytic literature talks about it as a "death of the world " fantasy as if the person truly feels so self-dead that eventually they wipe out the whole world to "join them" in non-existence.

It's absolutely petrifying - I do know that. But the ONLY way out of it to force yourself to ignore it as much as possible. Do not give into the fascination of it...force your attention and energies on "ordinary stuff" and it will feel like you're only faking it, but keep faking.

Peace,
janine
p.s. the universe IS real. And I know that now. But For years I DID NOT. It's not insanity, but I know you feel it is right now.

 

[Guest]

Janine,

Another truly insighful post. My only question is that I've had these thoughts since I was a kid, much earlier than the dp/dr. At that time, I didn't want to wipe the world away, but was very scared of the possibility that nothing was real. If I started having these thoughts just now, i could understand, but I wonder about the past, and wonder why these fears are wired into my brain (if I really exist 8) I think there might be a psychoanalytical explanation for this, am am trying to find out. it's really hard to deal with dp/dr when you are also wondering whether or not everything is real. Funny enough, when I saw the Matrix and truman show, I almost lost it b/c they reflected my thoughts and fears from childhood so well. WOW.

You guys all rock. I wish that everyone here finds happiness and relief from dp/dr. I'm sure there is a way out. Actually, I'm positive.

 

[Guest]

Well, you are grasping the gist of it, certainly. Here's the tricky part: it doesn't WORK to intellectually understand where these ideas are based (in the psyche) - although clearly that is one of MY hobbies, lol..and it's great to work to understand it all if you're going to make a career out of psychoanlaysis, or even want to dabble in the theory, etc. once you're recovered...but it's not the best idea to swamp yourself in it while you're still suffering.

I had the same ideas since childhood, of course. I always believed in the supernatural. Most kids "outgrow" those terrors, but not me. I just learned to keep it all to myself as I grew.

Until the illness/symptoms really hit me, I could move IN and OUT of those thoughts. I had most of the time where I could feel GOOD and normal and REAL. Then in back of my mind constantly was an underlying terror that I was just dreaming reality or had invented the entire world from my imagination.

Something scary would happen, and I'd succumb to those ideas and feel petrified. Then I'd bounce back up again, and as my mood changed, I could "re-orient" into feeling normal, and could "pretend" that the Awful Truth I really secretly knew maybe wasn't true after all.

Enter dp.

Then of course, I was CONVINCED I'd been right all along - clearly this was sign or proof that nothing existed, and I felt like I"d entered a new phase of "Awareness' about this hideous life. And I was off and running.

Those fears and ideas are based in self-annihilation fantasies and they usually stem from highly narcissistic states - in people who have uncanny self-observation and usually grandiose self images, juxtaposed with feelings of worthlessness and/or being nothing. The back and forth of those extremes are wear and tear on the Ego, and soon the entire Self feels under seige.
But trust me, there IS hope and this is not a permanent condition.

Peace,
Janine
of the Real World

 

[Guest]

Janine,

If you were a practicing therapist, I would move just to be near you :lol: For some reason, it seems that we share similar thoughts/thinking patterns, and I'm sure glad there is someone out there who is stronger than I am who can provide insight. I will try and stop analyzing everythng, but it is so, so hard, especially when u are alone. I feel like I can do nothing by analyze when I'm by myself. Plus, it may sound weird, but I 'm not really comfortable when I'm by myself b/c I fear my thoughts may start wandering, and I don;t reall reassure myself anymore. It's like that little voice inside of me which used to give me strength and comfort has gone away (still convinced I'm not crazy :wink: ) Anyways, I realize that it all starts from within, but as of now, I am afraid of myself. I know that sounds soooo odd, but I can't explain it any better. Thanks again for the great insight.

Jon

 

[Guest]

People with DP are involuntarily some of the best therapists I know. Anyone with a seemingly lesser mental illness can be cured by a certifiable dper. After enough time with it, everything is presented to you in black and white. Its too bad dp sometimes has a mind of its own otherwise it could be cured by something incredibly simple.

 

[jeremyfalcon]

hello, I am 14 years old and I'm going through a really similar experience as yours, I've smoked a joint which was laced with spice / k2 (synthetic marijuana) which was the worst trip I've ever been on which left me traumatised. I too ever since I was little had very deep thoughts about the universe and everything and even believing that I'm inside a simulation but deep inside I wasn't afraid until I smoked the spice. Its been a month since and its slowly fading away (my derealisation) but its truly the worst thing I can imagine. but what scares me the most is the fact that nothing is real and everything is just my imagination. I normally get these feelings when I'm thinking about it so I know not to think of it. It makes me panic a lot everytime. I need help tho because every moment i will feel like I'm dreaming and i just want to wake up with everything being normal again. I

 

[Aha's Shadow]

This thread has spoken to me more than any since I've been on this site. I'll write in more detail later. But I just had to say.

 

[forestx5]

Some of the worlds greatest minds are perplexed by the fact that experiments show there to be equal amounts of matter, and anti matter, in the universe. Since anti matter annihilates matter, there should be no universe at all. It would appear that reality exists

in the temporary separation of those two types of particles. They don't seem to be overly concerned about it, so neither am I. This separation has been around for a hundred billion years or more. In that time, living creatures have somehow been able to "tune" themselves

into a common reality. Some living creatures can see and hear and this helps them survive. Some can fly and some can swim. Some have infra red and some have radar. Oh well, to each his own. Whatever sensors a living creature might use to thrive and survive, the input from

those sensors go to a center in the brain for processing and analysis. In humans, that center is the temporal lobe. It is said to be "exquisitely prone to insult". Visual and audio input are analyzed, and memory is referenced so that an appropriate emotional response can be applied

to the circumstances as reported by stimuli. When your temporal lobe becomes impaired, your memory may fail. Your perceptions of self (dp) or your environment (dr) may be impaired. It is as if your reality radio is tuned slightly off station.

I experienced all of this, and I got some strange impulses that I was able to steer away from because my core intellect seemed to be uncompromised. If that had not been the case, I guess I would have warranted a diagnosis of psychosis. For many years, I functioned without positive emotions, relying "Spock like" on logic and reason. Slowly, I regained about 75% of

my previous emotional capacities. That was enough to survive.

 

[Aha's Shadow]

It's interesting that you should mention science, because that is literally the thing that has me absolutely melting down at the moment!

I was thinking about antibiotics and how they can somehow kill a disease. The two things are unrelated, have never touched eachother. Yet somehow through a random event one can basically destroy the other. People can explain how it works to me as many times as they like, except now I can't seem to accept it. I want to believe it, but can't.

I just can't make sense of anything, and then nonsensical things just keep happening. It's like the numbers thing, I know I rabbit on about it, but at any random moment of the day, if I look at my phone: There it is 7! Nine out of ten times a day. I just can't accept that it's random. It's the number I fear the most and it's always there at an apparently improbable rate!

This is why I keep reaching the conclusion that the world I'm experiencing isn't real, because it doesn't make sense! I can't understand apparently basic things about it, but somehow I'm watching myself move around and do 'normal things on the outside. And no I don't feel like I'm controlling it, nor do I feel like the things I'm doing are things I want to do.

I used to see the physical world as evidence that what I was told about being just anxious is true, but now I think, 'is this just what I'm being told?' That the world is real, when it's not? I mean surely if the world is subjective anyway, the idea of it even being real is also subjective.

I keep searching for what I'm missing. The only answer would be a truly amazing one at this point. If this is 'dp' then surely people have underestimated its power! I am consumed by this.

I would like to get back to the real world, but I know that there is no other world to escape to. Yet, weird things are happening, so I'm either right or bat shit crazy and just seeing things. The idea that I don't believe I'm in the real world scares me to death, but then I actually believe it! Wtf.

 

[forestx5]

I guess my point is that even when you are finely tuned into "reality", there are substantive questions that cannot be answered. So it is with the scientists who don't quite understand why the universe even exists, given the experiments showing equal amounts of matter and anti matter.

But, that does not contribute to a diagnosis of dp or dr for these scientists. They are tuned into reality. But reality has some static. They don't obsess about it. But when your static has static, that's dp or dr. lol

 

[nocturnalman]

Guess why we feel so scared when we think and believe that the world is not real.
I tell you why ,its because we think that if for example our brain is the creator of reality and all that we see and experience and it suddenly stops creating what we love (the world ,people ,just everything) we are left alone somewhere without anything ,and this all goes back to anxiety ,fear of being alone.Therefore it is important that when you have DR ,to socialize and realise that your are like anybody else with a brain that processes the world and does not create it

 

[person3]

If you search this board for Guest_Janinebaker_* (the one who had the great posts in this thread), you will find some great stuff to help with DP. She helped so any people on here...also wrote a couple of books about DP: "Tales of 1,001 Freudian nights" and "Unravelling". The second book is very practical for DP.

 

[Hosscat]

Yes, sometimes when I start feeling hopeless I look at her posts, since she had these thoughts extremely severe for an extremely long time. It offers some reassurance that even after years and years you can still get past it.

 

[Montgomery]

Hi. I am a 17 year old. I do not experience derealization as far as I'm aware. I still feel hear and see things normally. I just have a horrible overwhelming fear that my life isn't real. Like I'm in a coma and all the people I interact with aren't real. I can't take this. I feel so lonely and hopeless. How am i supposed to get help of I'm scared im trapped in a dream