Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment
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Interesting.
Perhaps, the point is to evaluate our lifestyles and where we are heading as a society/civilization before we destroy ourselves emotionally and physically. Or we could just go back to watching TV, getting drunk, and popping benzos.Martinelv said:
I'm sensing some hostility. 
The suggestions are somewhat implied in the post if you had read it completely. Its our need for continual progress that creates a situation where the destruction of our environment becomes common place. This mindset of endless forward progress also create artificial environments that affect us emotionally. Endless reams of information and media further inhibit our ability of experiencing positive emotion.
It's really just a matter of taking stock of where we are, recognizing what we are doing to ourselves, and changing our views of technology as the saviour of society. Create renewable energy, and discourage indiscriminate consumption and waste. This will never happen and is not simple. Thats fine, nature will humble us through natural processes resulting from our destruction of the environment. And if nature is slow to react, then war may do the same.
This is a situation where we drastically change, or the consequences will be a situation where the earth picks up the slack and sends us back into the stone age where we will have to subscribe to different beliefs about sustainable living. Like I said, most people believe the way we live is good and perfectly fine and live in denial about the effect that modern society is having on the world and on us as emotional beings.
The suggestions are somewhat implied in the post if you had read it completely. Its our need for continual progress that creates a situation where the destruction of our environment becomes common place. This mindset of endless forward progress also create artificial environments that affect us emotionally. Endless reams of information and media further inhibit our ability of experiencing positive emotion.
It's really just a matter of taking stock of where we are, recognizing what we are doing to ourselves, and changing our views of technology as the saviour of society. Create renewable energy, and discourage indiscriminate consumption and waste. This will never happen and is not simple. Thats fine, nature will humble us through natural processes resulting from our destruction of the environment. And if nature is slow to react, then war may do the same.
This is a situation where we drastically change, or the consequences will be a situation where the earth picks up the slack and sends us back into the stone age where we will have to subscribe to different beliefs about sustainable living. Like I said, most people believe the way we live is good and perfectly fine and live in denial about the effect that modern society is having on the world and on us as emotional beings.
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So true scattered! ^^^^^^ I see the world as a spinning top, that spins at a wobble. The faster we turn, the worse the wobble becomes! The more obvious the wobble is!Scattered said:I'm sensing some hostility.
The suggestions are somewhat implied in the post if you had read it completely. Its our need for continual progress that creates a situation where the destruction of our environment becomes common place. This mindset of endless forward progress also create artificial environments that affect us emotionally. Endless reams of information and media further inhibit our ability of experiencing positive emotion.
It's really just a matter of taking stock of where we are, recognizing what we are doing to ourselves, and changing our views of technology as the saviour of society. Create renewable energy, and discourage indiscriminate consumption and waste. This will never happen and is not simple. Thats fine, nature will humble us through natural processes resulting from our destruction of the environment. And if nature is slow to react, then war may do the same.
This is a situation where we drastically change, or the consequences will be a situation where the earth picks up the slack and sends us back into the stone age where we will have to subscribe to different beliefs about sustainable living. Like I said, most people believe the way we live is good and perfectly fine and live in denial about the effect that modern society is having on the world and on us as emotional beings.
The world wobbles either because of its natural tendency to do so or because of our actions and the effect we have on it. There are some natural things we can't avoid, however, there are many unnatural variables that have been introduced at the advent of modern industrial society. So I personally don't view this as a doomsday scenario, I view it as a potential one if we don't change our lives to some extent. Like everything else, its a choice.
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very very interesting. but its not so scientific as it is common sense. the effects are everywhere. im very in tune/connected to this truth. its called 'waking up'. and once you truly awaken, you see how you have lived your life as an utter hippocrate. you have a dog that you hug and a child that you love but you eat cows and chicken and pigs without thought or remorse. you care about the environment, and make contributions to the world wildlife fund, yet you feel perfectly comfortable owning more than one Mcmansion that sit on endangered habitats. you are right the capitolist mindset is one of disconnect. disconnect from emotion, disconnect from reality. if its not right in my face then it cant be happening. see no evil speak no evil hear no evil. thats how we view wars, the food we eat, the way we treat each other, the way we treat ourselves. i cant see how this pint of hagendaz is clogging my arteries and shortening my life, so it must not be happening. its so silly and sad. how come we are so willing to turn away from the truth?? because the truth hurts?? yes!!!
but the truth will set you free. i feel better than ive ever felt. and thats the truth. my eyes are open now and i refuse to shut them anymore. i refuse to deny my impact on this world.
but the truth will set you free. i feel better than ive ever felt. and thats the truth. my eyes are open now and i refuse to shut them anymore. i refuse to deny my impact on this world.
No F*****g hostility here mate ! :wink:
I just want you, once, just once, to make a positive suggestion about how, perhaps, just perhaps, we could make our lives a little more bareable, despite the world being a pile of crap, other than indulging your misey. I will pay you $5 if you succeed.
"Intelligence is the biggest cause/ source of destruction in this world.
[In fact Intelligence is the only cause of destruction in this world other than natural causes]
MENTAL WORK IS INJURIOUS TO THE MIND AND PLANET."
...truly hysterical, no seriously, this made my day. I agree, I would have been far better of born as a vegetable.
Perhaps a cabbage?
NO! PARSNIP!
[In fact Intelligence is the only cause of destruction in this world other than natural causes]
MENTAL WORK IS INJURIOUS TO THE MIND AND PLANET."
...truly hysterical, no seriously, this made my day. I agree, I would have been far better of born as a vegetable.
Perhaps a cabbage?
NO! PARSNIP!
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the point could have been made without the sarcasm. but i do see your point bright23 and its a good one.
i also disagree with that portion of this post. intelligence does not distroy. stupidity, the opposite of intelligence does that. sure you can argue that intelligent minds split the atom. but if those minds were truly thoughtful and intelligent they wouldnt have gone there in the first place. thats the state of the world at the moment. completely misguided and stupid. "im so smart because i just discovered a brand new way to kill things!"
not so smart if you ask me. :roll:
i also disagree with that portion of this post. intelligence does not distroy. stupidity, the opposite of intelligence does that. sure you can argue that intelligent minds split the atom. but if those minds were truly thoughtful and intelligent they wouldnt have gone there in the first place. thats the state of the world at the moment. completely misguided and stupid. "im so smart because i just discovered a brand new way to kill things!"
not so smart if you ask me. :roll:
And the problem is that people disagree about what is intelligent and what is not intelligent.
Objectively, it took alot of intelligence to create the atom bomb, the automobile, the computer, and all other features of modern society. It took a great deal of intelligence to then implement these ideas. Regardless of whether or not they have negative effects, they do require intelligence.
I disagree with the point that all intelligence leads to destruction. But there is a point to be made that many things which we consider to be the product of immense intelligence, lead to death, destruction, or ultimately living conditions that are not as positive as we may have first believed.
Objectively, it took alot of intelligence to create the atom bomb, the automobile, the computer, and all other features of modern society. It took a great deal of intelligence to then implement these ideas. Regardless of whether or not they have negative effects, they do require intelligence.
I disagree with the point that all intelligence leads to destruction. But there is a point to be made that many things which we consider to be the product of immense intelligence, lead to death, destruction, or ultimately living conditions that are not as positive as we may have first believed.
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BRAVO!!
YES THAT IS EXACTLY THE TRUTH. EVERYTHING YOU SAY.
by thinking positive you are talking about turning a blind eye to truth. turning off reality because it is painful and makes us confront our own hipocracy. hipocracy MUST END. complacency MUST END. greed and envy MUST END. dissociation MUST END! there is no alternative. if we continue on this path there will be nothing left to give our children. we have become so arrogant that we have dismissed the future completely. there is no future. not for us or for the one who gives us life, The Gaia. she will have to cleanse and start over from scratch. call it the end times, but thats where we are headed and it has nothing to do with a spiritual realm. its all about the REAL. its called our REALITY. its great to think positive when you are sitting in a pit filled with sh!t but that does nothing to improve your situation. youre still sitting in the pit of sh!t. it takes confrontation of the situation, accepting that you are indeed in a predicament, accepting your own personal responsibility, and making the nescisary effort to fix the situation. its called personal responsibility. no one wants to take responsibility for their actions anymore. they want to pass the buck. pretend that their impact doesnt count somehow. thats bullsh!t. your impact is HUGE. i will post some real statistics that explain further about this personal impact another time cause its way past my bedtime.
great post shushil. ROCK ON. 8)
YES THAT IS EXACTLY THE TRUTH. EVERYTHING YOU SAY.
by thinking positive you are talking about turning a blind eye to truth. turning off reality because it is painful and makes us confront our own hipocracy. hipocracy MUST END. complacency MUST END. greed and envy MUST END. dissociation MUST END! there is no alternative. if we continue on this path there will be nothing left to give our children. we have become so arrogant that we have dismissed the future completely. there is no future. not for us or for the one who gives us life, The Gaia. she will have to cleanse and start over from scratch. call it the end times, but thats where we are headed and it has nothing to do with a spiritual realm. its all about the REAL. its called our REALITY. its great to think positive when you are sitting in a pit filled with sh!t but that does nothing to improve your situation. youre still sitting in the pit of sh!t. it takes confrontation of the situation, accepting that you are indeed in a predicament, accepting your own personal responsibility, and making the nescisary effort to fix the situation. its called personal responsibility. no one wants to take responsibility for their actions anymore. they want to pass the buck. pretend that their impact doesnt count somehow. thats bullsh!t. your impact is HUGE. i will post some real statistics that explain further about this personal impact another time cause its way past my bedtime.
great post shushil. ROCK ON. 8)
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very true.this happened in pre industrial society on the easter island in the pacific.there,rival tribes ended up cutting down all the trees in order to transport stone dieties to the beaches in a form of anscestor worship.it turned into a massive competition that went out of control.rivalry grew between the clans to see who could build the most monuments.as a result,all the trees were cut down,the soil washed away,and the descendents either starved or drowned trying to escape the island.this was a mere 300 years ago.it wasnt industrial society,but it shows how harmful the human ego can be
To sum up - 'true' intelligence is self-defeating. We can't help ourselves.
The percieved 'curse' of industrialised society is nonsense. Reactionary cultural rubbish. Our 'curse' began as soon as we crawled out of the swap and started becoming self-aware.
People in Afria and religious communities don't cause harm to our planet. Rubbish. They would if they had the chance or inclination. Don't fool yourself into thinking that primitive people are to be admired because they don't pump CO2 into the atmosphere.
We are all in the same boat. As long as we have a brain, we are all as culpable as each other.
The percieved 'curse' of industrialised society is nonsense. Reactionary cultural rubbish. Our 'curse' began as soon as we crawled out of the swap and started becoming self-aware.
People in Afria and religious communities don't cause harm to our planet. Rubbish. They would if they had the chance or inclination. Don't fool yourself into thinking that primitive people are to be admired because they don't pump CO2 into the atmosphere.
We are all in the same boat. As long as we have a brain, we are all as culpable as each other.
While I admire your nihilism, I have to disagree...somewhat. Yes, less technologically advanced cultures would probably be as inclined to destroy the world if they were in a position to do so. The point is that they aren't. Their life style, and it all depends on what culture we're talking about, is generally more in harmony with their physical environment. They depend on their immediate surroundings for survival and as such do minimal damage to it. This is more a question of practicality rather than motivation. They are to be looked at as a model not because they are supreme examples of morality, but because the constraints of their lifestyle FORCE them to do less damage. And thats fine.
The end result we want is not one of transcending basic human motivations and inclinations, but a lifetsyle that suppresses our inner need to self-destruct.
The end result we want is not one of transcending basic human motivations and inclinations, but a lifetsyle that suppresses our inner need to self-destruct.
You've hit the nail on the head. "Constraints". If we plucked them from their forest huts and gave them a generation or two to purge themselves of their 'primitive' ways, they would be exactly the same as you and me.
I guess your suggestion is that we, like Tyler in fight club, should revert to an more simple age, a more simple time, when we respect each other and the resources available to us. I'm not as positive about this as you are. Our progress as a species is unstoppable...and sooner or later we will reap the 'terrible' benefits. And then, perhaps, we shall have to revert to living of the earth. But I doubt, really doubt if that will ever happen. Consumerism, capitalism, the weakinging of morality, the ceaseless motivation for 'more, relentless greed...all are unique to our species...and it's increasing at a shocking speed.
Look around you. Depression or not - we are really quite evil creatures. Even the smallest child knows we are the most dangerous animal on the planet. We're even quite nasty to look at - skinny, defenceless hairless apes. We torture animals, we treat oter species, at best, as curios, we rape the planet without a seconds thought, and justify this by our feelings of love and the fact that we build (concreting over a nice field or park) nice buildings. Art, music, ocassional acts of selfless kindness, yes - lovely. But who enjoys them apart from us.....nobody, nothing. We are the epitome of selfishness, and we can't help it. Nothing we can do about it. That's why we are doomed.
But I, as a selfish man, don't give a damn.
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Honestly, I think the world is at a turning point. Look at what you've written, Sushil Yadav. Would someone have written that during the Industrial Revolution of Great Britain? I think not. Would they have written it in 1940's America? Fast forward. The outcry is so great around the world to clean up our mistakes where we can and prevent them in the future regarding our environment, that who knows? You may find that your pessimism is feeding the very mindset you hate. As self-aware creatures, we have an ability that no other animal has, although you may lump us in as the most harmful of all. We have the ability to analyze and change our behavior. And the ability to do this only comes with intelligence. To be very specific, with a well-developed pre-frontal cortex, which is something that no other species has. People without a well-developed one tend to be thoughtless. The more one thinks, the more you weigh things other people say, such as your post.
Peace
Homeskooled
Peace
Homeskooled
I'm not some idealist that thinks we are just going to stop to live the way we are living. There's far too much money and power involved in the scheme of things for society as a whole to just jump ship and revert back to primitive tribes. This is going to happen as a result of rampant greedd that leads to the destruction of our current way of life and FORCES us to live more sustainably. Once that happens, I think we have a chance. But as the system is now, I don't believe there is much chance for reform.
I agree with both of you (note the time and date!), but I don't share your optimism Homeskooled, and I'm wary of saying that we are at a 'turning point'. People have said that throughout the ages. I think the only thing that would unite us as a people is something terribly dramatic like Nuclear war, or (don't laugh) the discovery of alien life. Homey - we've had these marvelous brains for milleniums...and it's just getting worse...
But I do agree somewhat with Scattered has to say. Unless there is some miraculous change of attitude (for a start - seperating church and state would be a good thing), and everyone stop being so relentlessly selfish etc, but I don't think we are capable of that. Our very nature and our short life span where we try and cram as much experience into as possible precludes this. It's not really our fault, we can't help ourselves, we just do without regard (except for tree-huggers and the small minority of environmentalists) for anything else. Much like cancer.
But, I repeat, I don't care. I am a cancer cell amoung billions of other cancer cells. I'll just get carried along with the ride.
But I do agree somewhat with Scattered has to say. Unless there is some miraculous change of attitude (for a start - seperating church and state would be a good thing), and everyone stop being so relentlessly selfish etc, but I don't think we are capable of that. Our very nature and our short life span where we try and cram as much experience into as possible precludes this. It's not really our fault, we can't help ourselves, we just do without regard (except for tree-huggers and the small minority of environmentalists) for anything else. Much like cancer.
But, I repeat, I don't care. I am a cancer cell amoung billions of other cancer cells. I'll just get carried along with the ride.
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