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Let me help you out. I was depersonalized for a year waiting for it to fade away. I had some aha-moments when I had spent hours without feeling strange. That's when I was doing something absorbing. That's when I realized this dp was nothing serious but a matter of focus. I learned to handle uncertainty in a healthy way and now I'm dp free. I can suggest myself into dp any second if I want to but I can choose not to.

Dp is an obsession. Nothing more. You cope with uncertainty by trying to figure it out. You check, you try to feel like yourself, you look for reassurance, you read articles, you spend countless hours on google... all this trying to solve the feeling and trying to make the feeling go away. You check and you check until you can't feel certain about anything. The uncertainties become unsolvable like "what if I'm not real?". Let me tell you something. This is called compulsive behavior. When you have obsessions, compulsive behaviors are the fuel that keep obsessions going. You can't handle the uncertainty so you react with compulsions. Compulsive behaviors feel like they are the solution, but in fact they are the root of the problem. Don't go after obsessions, go after compulsions! By identifying your compulsions, you can start cutting them out. Look for anything you do in order to cope, control and check. Then cut those behaviors out! When you do this, your anxiety will rise. You'll feel a need to go back to compulsive behaviors. But when you resist and move your focus back to the real actual situation that's going on, your brain will learn dp is nothing to be afraid of. It's just a feeling and never leads to anything else. You'll learn you feel depersonalized every time after you engage in checking compulsions. When you learn to react to uncertainty in a healthier way, dp will start to fade away.
"Am I feeling the right way?"
"Do I feel real? Do my memories feel real? Do my loved ones feel real?"
"Do I feel as secure as I should? Do I feel as grounded/connected as I should?"
"Do I feel the right amount of love towards the things I really care about?"
"Does this feeling mean I'm going to lose it and go crazy?"
"Did I really understand the advice juustopallo was giving me?"
"What if I believed I was an alpaca?
Etcetc. --> mental checking!!

Accept the feeling. You can have any feeling, any thought and still act according to the actual situation and according to your values. Live your life and stop trying to solve the feeling. Feelings aren't things to be solved. It's ok to not feel like yourself all the time. It's ok to feel uncertain. It's ok to feel anxious. Refocus your attention and take the unpleasant feeling with you. It's ok to not feel connected. When you learn this, you can react to the feeling by not engaging in compulsive checking behaviors. Cutting out the compulsions will make you feel normal again. Make the things you care about the center of your life again. See your friends, study, go to work, excercise... all the normal stuff! Do it every day no matter how you feel. This way you'll learn dp stops you from nothing. It's just a feeling and you can have any feeling!

I hope this helps! If you have any questions, feel free to ask! Dp is just an obsession! All obsessions are the same and they can be managed!
 

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People do have such conditions for sure, but according to my experiences on this forum, most of the people are self diagnosed google experts. They spend all of their time worrying about their condition instead of living their lives. That's what I did too until I changed my behaviors and started to react to uncertainty differently! I was sure I had lyme's disease or thyroid problems. I got checked for a million times! At one point I was even sure I was going psychotic. None of this was true even though it sounded very convincing to me. If you really have such problems, doctors can test these diseases easily and give you the proper medication for them.

Even though you had some of the conditions you mentioned, you could still live a fulfilling life by living according to your values and doing what is really meaningful. By engaging in compulsions such as rumination, we only make the situation worse. We can never worry ourselves into schizophrenia, lyme's disease etc, but we can definitely worry ourselves to feelings of depersonalization, anxiety, depression and despair. If you don't believe me, check out ocd forums and be surprised how many of the ocd and other anxiety disorder sufferers worry about the feelings of depersonalization and solipsism. The themes of our worries don't matter. We have to learn to react to uncertainty in a healthier way!

DP is a natural result of engaging in checking compulsions. By cutting out our compulsions, we can learn to come out of our heads and focus on our real lives again! Recovery is possible, but it requires some big changes both in our beliefs and our behaviors.
 

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People do have such conditions for sure, but according to my experiences on this forum, most of the people are self diagnosed google experts. They spend all of their time worrying about their condition instead of living their lives. That's what I did too until I changed my behaviors and started to react to uncertainty differently! I was sure I had lyme's disease or thyroid problems. I got checked for a million times! At one point I was even sure I was going psychotic. None of this was true even though it sounded very convincing to me. If you really have such problems, doctors can test these diseases easily and give you the proper medication for them.

Even though you had some of the conditions you mentioned, you could still live a fulfilling life by living according to your values and doing what is really meaningful. By engaging in compulsions such as rumination, we only make the situation worse. We can never worry ourselves into schizophrenia, lyme's disease etc, but we can definitely worry ourselves to feelings of depersonalization, anxiety, depression and despair. If you don't believe me, check out ocd forums and be surprised how many of the ocd and other anxiety disorder sufferers worry about the feelings of depersonalization and solipsism. The themes of our worries don't matter. We have to learn to react to uncertainty in a healthier way!

DP is a natural result of engaging in checking compulsions. By cutting out our compulsions, we can learn to come out of our heads and focus on our real lives again! Recovery is possible, but it requires some big changes both in our beliefs and our behaviors.
MY DP is over, what i should do with anhedonia and depression now? ignore it?
 

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MY DP is over, what i should do with anhedonia and depression now? ignore it?
I'm not a professional. Only an expertice by experience. I'd recommend cognitive behavioral therapy and doing every day something you enjoy. Spending time with other people and having something meaningful to do every day would be a great start!
Recommended reading: Russ Harris - Happiness Trap

EDIT: Often times depression is only your body-mind's signal that something's not right. While living the life you value, try figure out behaviors (also mental) that you do that make you feel down. Feelings of sadness are also nothing to be afraid of but possible gateways to better self understanding. Learn what gives you long term satisfaction and fill your days with those things!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
You can always use medication and many kinds of easing ways to create distance to these feelings. This too is helpful and even necessary for some people. But if you want to learn the skills to handle difficult feelings, you have to take the actual steps. Just by tackling one uncertainty, your brain will most likely come up with a new one that makes you worry at least as much as the previous one. That's why it's so important to change our relationship with uncertainty period. Therapy (erp, act, cbt) is the best way in my opinion. Most therapists won't understand dp very well, but you can apply the techniques you learn in therapy to live with, manage and finally overcome all kinds of difficult feelings including depersonalization and derealization. It is managable by doing it yourself but a good therapist is always an enormous help!

Add to my reading recommendations: Mark Freeman - The Mind Workout
 

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You can always use medication and many kinds of easing ways to create distance to these feelings. This too is helpful and even necessary for some people. But if you want to learn the skills to handle difficult feelings, you have to take the actual steps. Just by tackling one uncertainty, your brain will most likely come up with a new one that makes you worry at least as much as the previous one. That's why it's so important to change our relationship with uncertainty period. Therapy (erp, act, cbt) is the best way in my opinion. Most therapists won't understand dp very well, but you can apply the techniques you learn in therapy to live with, manage and finally overcome all kinds of difficult feelings including depersonalization and derealization. It is managable by doing it yourself but a good therapist is always an enormous help!

Add to my reading recommendations: Mark Freeman - The Mind Workout
what about people with schizophrenia and dp. Will this work for them?))) i am doubt about it
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
thanksforbeingalive, why are you being so aggressive to this poster?
It's okay! We are on this forum for a reason! We have faced huge struggles. But together we can learn to take steps towards a better and more fulfilling life! I wish to help each and every one who's dealing with dp in their daily life. I know it can be very difficult. But recovery is possible. I know it from experience!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Someone pm:d me and had some great questions! I thought it would be a good thing to share our conversation. Hopefully some of you find this helpful! :)

DP Sufferer: ''I can't stop obsessing on how I am able to think and speak. It's like I feel like I've become aware of the fact so much that happens in our life I die to programming and it's depressed me because I feel like the fate of my life is limited in a sense and everything happens and is controlled by my mind''

Juustopallo: I'm a former ocd sufferer, current normal life practicioner myself. I've had every single theme of ocd I can imagine! I've obsessed about religion, relationships, diseases, my bodily functions, death... you name it! What I've learned along my journey is that all the themes are the same. We can obsess about anything. Often times when we think we've crushed one theme, our brain comes up with a next one. A horrifying thought pops up in our heads, we feel threatened by it and start engaging in all kinds of compulsions in order to make the thought go away. But what is important, is not the theme but our relationship with uncertainty. We think crushing one uncertainty will make us feel better but then we find another uncertainty we start to obsess about. It can be anything our minds can come up with! Our thoughts often times don't relfect who we are and what we really want. I think it could be useful to go after uncertainty itself. We don't need to solve any thought or any feeling. We can have them all and still act according to what is really meaningful and relevant at the moment. We create a new relationship with uncertainty. It's ok for the uncertainty to be there. Take it with you and start focusing on other things. If you feel depersonalized, take the uncertainty about yourself with you and do all the normal stuff. At first it can feel like you're cheating yourself but with time you'll teach your brain that (or any other) uncertainty is nothing to be worried about. The feelings will start to fade since it becomes totally irrelevant. Nowadays I can have any thought about my previous ocd themes and choose not to react to them with compulsions. I refocus my attention "okay I had a scary thought but I'm in a middle of the conversation right now". When I refocus my attention to the conversation, I often forget about the thought just few seconds later. My brain knows those thoughts are not important because I've chosen to practice normal stuff, not the compulsions''

DP Sufferer: ''The fact you have experience with ocd is BIG for me because I don't think dp is my problem as much as ocd.''

Juustopallo: ''I think mental health labels aren't that important. A lot of the thing "normal" people do are similar to ones the people struggling with mental health issues do. Anyone can start obsessing about anything. Everybody has a a brain and therefore everybody has a mental health. My ocd was never diagnosed but after stuggling with anxiety for a long time, I realized I'd developed a lot of absurd obsessions. It was a practice. Now I've decided to practice things that keep me healthy. Engaging in compulsive behaviors is not one of them. I no longer obsess about feeling weird, disconnected etc. That was a natural result of engaging in all kinds of checking compulsions. It can happen to anyone but anyone can also learn to take take necessary steps to a better mental health!''

DP Sufferer: ''Did you ever have issues with obsessing over where your thoughts came from or how you are able to think and shit?

Juustopallo: ''Oh yes yes, all that! I remember my therapist even looking me funny when I went to visit him "I've been crying the whole morning because I don't know what thoughts are and where they come from!" XD

Same has happened with many other bodily or psychological functions too. It's all about uncertainty! Remember - the theme is not important. The themes are all the same. Go after compulsions, not obsessions!


DP Sufferer: ''So like just now I was sitting in class and my eyes started moving and I become aware of myself gazing off and it kind of freaked me out? Then I'll comstsntly obsess and feel hopeless with the thought that everything in the brain just happens and figures itself out so how much free will or control do I have other then the feeling of feeling good? Seriously I obsess like 24/7 about how I don't control my brain and it just does what it wants and I am along for the ride. Like everything I do and am successful at now I question because I feel lack of control and am just like "well that's Just my brain doing what it wants"

Juustopallo: ''Don't worry, I know what it's like :)

I bet in those moments you feel like you shouldn't focus on your thoughts, right? You do anything to get that fear outof your mind. You try to rationalize, you look for reassurance (at least here on internet), you google, you try to feel normal, you check for weird feeling thoughts, you ruminate, you argue with your thoughts in your head... (No wonder the thoughts start to feel weird and spacely!) All the things you do in order to cope, check and control are the compulsions you should go after and cut them out. Be willing to feel uncertain about your brain and your existence. Take the uncertainty with you and focus on real and relevant things, like what you're supposed to learn in class! You can do it even with that uncertainty with you!''


DP Sufferer: ''What would be an example of compulsions I may have?

Juustopallo: ''I already named many of the compulsions you probably engage in. "You do anything to get that fear out of your mind. You try to rationalize, you look for reassurance (at least here on internet), you google, you try to feel normal, you check for weird feeling thoughts, you ruminate, you argue with your thoughts in your head... (No wonder the thoughts start to feel weird and spacely!) All the things you do in order to cope, check and control are the compulsions". Behind these compulsions are beliefs about your thoughts. You may feel like it's dangerous to feel certain way of have a certain thought. But that is not true. You can have any damn thought in the world! You can question any damn bodily function! And still the world stays the same and you stay safe.

You might also hold beliefs that having certain images or certain feelings is dangerous. You might hold beliefs that you must solve every anxiousness provoking uncertainty you experience. These beliefs are not based on reality and they can be one of the reasons for obsessions and engaging in compulsions''


DP Sufferer: ''Wow awesome reponse and in depth. I completely agree and right now I feel like I need to work in the fear that is associated with these thoughts? Or? I feel like what causes fear in me is the logic of these thoughts and the uncertainty behind them so I feel like I am trying to deal with that by accepting uncertainty and loosening up control''

Juustopallo: ''You got it right! But don't try to "feel certain" about accepting the uncertainty xD just go on with your day with all the scary thoughts in your head. Find something fun to do! I used to just it home trying to solve my problems by outhinking them. That's not how it works. By having stuff to do you'll create distance between you and your thoughts. Soon you'll obsess much less. And when that happens, you'll start to trust life again :) then you'll know that it's totally ok to feel uncertain and try not to solve the uncertainties! This way the obsessions will start to fade away since you have learned a much healthier way to deal with uncertainty! Just like mental illness is a practice (avoiding experiences), recovery is a practice! Cutting out the behaviors (also mental!) that feed obsessions + doing the things we value result in better life and more flexible mind!

DP Sufferer: ''So when you said check and control is what I should focus on, any examples how to go about that? BTW I have noticed the pattern but the fear I experience is what cripples me. Most subjects don't cause me that much distress. But this existential shit crippppppppples me.''

Juustopallo: ''By checking I mean everything you check to make uncertainty go away or gain a sense of control. When someone has an obsession about the fear of accidentally burning their house, they start checking the stove countless times a day. And the more they do it, the stronger the obsession gets. When you obsess about existential stuff, the checks are more mental. You might mentally check if you feel like yourself, if your loved ones feel real, if your thoughts and images feel "just right". You might stare at photos of yourself trying to feel like you. You might check if you can move your body by will or if you can consciously create a certain thought... all this is mental checking. The more you do it, the stronger the obsession gets and the weirder you feel. Whenever you feel weird with the existential bullshit, you can know it's totally a natural result of engaging in this type of checking compulsions. It's kind of a self suggestion. Nothing serious but I bet you want to stop the rat wheel by stopping hitting yourself.

Then what I mean by control is that you ruminate countless hours trying to debate your thoughts, trying to find the answers to reach a sense of control. You might read articles and books about the issue to make you feel safer. Ask for reassurance, avoid experiences by escapism... this too is compulsive behavior.

A helpful advice might be that don't chase after feelings. Whenever you find yourself trying to "feel just right" about anything, stop!

And this is about all uncertainty you experience! Not just about your current particular theme. I had an ear infection earlier this week. No one knows how long infections last, if they are a beginning to something serious etc. I was worried about my health and reacted to the uncertainty by googling everything about ear infection. At some point I realized that what I'm doing is the same exact thing I used to do with my ocd themes. The more I googled, the more worried I became and the more time I spent catastrophizing in my head. I stopped googling immediately when I realized that. We must learn to react to uncertainty in a healthy way in all parts of our lives. Not just the one particular theme.''


DP Sufferer: ''Damn... that's real... it's so nice to hear someone who really understands it and can talk about it... because I do all that shit... check to see if I'm conscious... check to see if I had control of that thought... check to see how I feel. I will move my damn hand in front of me or do something with my foot... just to see if I'm control of it and think how did that happen.. it's crazy... you're dead right... have you ever been depressed before? And what was your relationship ocd like?''

Juustopallo: ''If you do all that, is it even surprising you end up feeling weird and spacey at times? :D It's like self-suggestion! Those feelings are a natural result of engaging in compulsions.

I have felt bad alright. Sad and hopeless. Of course I had a good reason to feel bad because I was torturing myself with compulsions 24/7. How else could it be? But I always took the feelings of depression as a sign that something is not right. Like when you break your leg, you don't have a pain problem, you have a broken leg. The pain is your body's way of telling that something's not right. I take depression much in a same way. When I started to live my life again (study, see my friends, go out, read, write, exercise, go to church...) I saw how depression started to lift. There was no more need to be depressed since my focus wasn't 24/7 on my fears but in actual life. I'm living the life I want to live again! I do know that if I'd spend all my days home ruminating and worrying about stuff, I'd probably end up relapsing. That's why I practice things that keep me healthy. Very basic stuff.

I've also obsessed about depression. I had this huge fear of depression and ending up suicidal. I constantly checked if things felt satisfying or important enough. I also checked how I feel constantly - often self-suggesting myself into feeling bad. See how the pattern is always the same even though the themes change? In my relationship ocd I was super afraid that I'd stop loving my dear girlfriend. Constantly checking on feelings when I thought of her or when I was spending time with other women. Often self-suggesting myself to feeling bad. The pattern is always the same. Themes don't matter!

How I got over these themes was accepting the uncertainty: ''okay I'll take the risk that I'd stop loving my girlfriend (/ go crazy / become suicidal / whatever) but now I choose to take this uncertainty with me and go on with my day''.''


 

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Hey I been doing this stuff, watched marks videos a lot. Thing is, I don't know how to stop the compulsions sometimes. Especially the rationalizations and debating the thoughts in my head. I get so anxious sometimes that I almost developed Cotard's delusions. Feels like im trapped in my head. On top of that what do you do about the constant background anxiety? sometimes it seriously feels like im trapped in a hell prison of torture.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Compulsions are a type of behavior. We are so used to them that sometimes we don't even realize how much time and energy we put in to them. It's not easy to change strong behavioral patterns. The change doesn't happen overnight but requires a lot of practice. We have to take the steps ourselves. When we feel an uncertainty about our nature or nature of existence, we feel an urge to check whether or not we feel "normal". This is the moment when I tell myself to refocus my attention to what's really going on. Focus on conversation I'm having, focus on doing, not feeling. After doing this time after time it becomes a new behavioral pattern and gradually easier to do.

About the anxiety and feelings of dp, I'd suggest for you to take a look on your beliefs about those feelings. You might believe that feeling anxious or depersonalized is an end of world and something dangerous. This belief however is not based on reality. You can have any feeling and it's totally natural. You get feelings of depersonalization by engaging in checking compulsions. Not a biggie. It's totally ok to have any uncertainty in your head. You don't have to solve the uncertainty. It fades away when you focus on other things than checking. You can do anything and act according to your values while havinh that feeling. This makes your mind more flexible. Soon the feeling doesn't bother you. You have changed your belief from "this is dangerous" to "this is not important". Do all the normal stuff while having those feelings. Live your life while having those feelings. This way you can teach your brain something new about those feelings. They stop controlling your life and become more fleeting and eventually fade away since you're not afraid of them anymore.
 

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This way of looking to DP/DR specially correct to people whose self-diagnosed themselves with DP/DR and mostly young or unmotivated/in depression/high on anxiety people.

The thing that saved you from these loopholes was the "Awareness", you became aware of what is going on in your head and you accepted and move on, you didn't fight with it, that might also be called proper use of "Mindfulness" in a sense. Most of the time people fail in step one. Certainly who has these kind of diseases lack "Awareness" that is why people tend to stay on the same mental disease or doing same mental loops everyday and can't escape this mechanism for years. But it is not their fault per se, the brain goes defence mode and shutdowns critical thinking a.k.a logical approaching. So brain is foggy and you can't solve shit. That is why most of the people have blank mind here. That is the last stop after ruminating and obsessive-compulsive thinking and frying your mind with cortisol death hormone.

The brain is a really really complex thing, it is not an easy identifable structure or solveable puzzle like it writes on most online articles. You can have past traumas or you may have not forgiven people in your past and you can't even tell your self no I have moved on, but your mind buried these stuff deep down sometimes so you won't feel their pain any longer, and cause you to depersonaliza and dissociate from your body and feeling, and even from your mind to alleviate the pain(cause of blank mind,numb body, anhedonic symtomps). And these stuff can give you really hard time and cause you many symtomps even DP/DR because they would increase anxiety/depression and obsessive thinking by forcing your body to go defensive system by increasing cortisol in your body, because you will still be in a war suit.

What I'm trying to say here is this: people need to find even a small amount of energy to do self-reflection every day night. and dig deeper into their past and their psyche. If you read all kinds of forums and these stuff, you are lucky, stop reading for a magic bullet or magic cure but search what is within you, because the problem lies within. Seek answers for these questions , what could have been bothering me that happened in the past, Do I still hate my old boyfriend for what he did, Do I still resent my mother for loving my brother more. Do I hate this life because I have these conditions, Why I Am like this, What I am not accepting or still resenting. Etc etc it goes on, you can understand the concept and generate these questions to go deeper.

The aggressive guy who said he had Depression and Anhedonia you better read this shit buddy, your salvation from these kind of diseases won't be helped by leashing your anger and frustration online on people. I understand you, I completely understand you. Because you feel anger feeling like this. ı was once there. But this is a matter of taking responsibility of yourself and trying to do anything each day. No one is coming to save you, nor your parents nor jesus nor God. I gotta say no magic cure will coming any sooner buddy. Every one of us gotta start something small and we gotta start today. I understand there are some people who are worse in their condition and I pray to god to help them more than us. Yet there are simple things in the human system that could cause these things and there are simple steps than can alleviate these hard-stricken hellish symptomps from our bodies and minds. But there are complex approaches to erase this for good. These small steps starts with " Gratitude, Awareness, Acceptance, Self-Love and Empathy" Best of Luck to all.
 

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This way of looking to DP/DR specially correct to people whose self-diagnosed themselves with DP/DR and mostly young or unmotivated/in depression/high on anxiety people.

The thing that saved you from these loopholes was the "Awareness", you became aware of what is going on in your head and you accepted and move on, you didn't fight with it, that might also be called proper use of "Mindfulness" in a sense. Most of the time people fail in step one. Certainly who has these kind of diseases lack "Awareness" that is why people tend to stay on the same mental disease or doing same mental loops everyday and can't escape this mechanism for years. But it is not their fault per se, the brain goes defence mode and shutdowns critical thinking a.k.a logical approaching. So brain is foggy and you can't solve shit. That is why most of the people have blank mind here. That is the last stop after ruminating and obsessive-compulsive thinking and frying your mind with cortisol death hormone.

The brain is a really really complex thing, it is not an easy identifable structure or solveable puzzle like it writes on most online articles. You can have past traumas or you may have not forgiven people in your past and you can't even tell your self no I have moved on, but your mind buried these stuff deep down sometimes so you won't feel their pain any longer, and cause you to depersonaliza and dissociate from your body and feeling, and even from your mind to alleviate the pain(cause of blank mind,numb body, anhedonic symtomps). And these stuff can give you really hard time and cause you many symtomps even DP/DR because they would increase anxiety/depression and obsessive thinking by forcing your body to go defensive system by increasing cortisol in your body, because you will still be in a war suit.

What I'm trying to say here is this: people need to find even a small amount of energy to do self-reflection every day night. and dig deeper into their past and their psyche. If you read all kinds of forums and these stuff, you are lucky, stop reading for a magic bullet or magic cure but search what is within you, because the problem lies within. Seek answers for these questions , what could have been bothering me that happened in the past, Do I still hate my old boyfriend for what he did, Do I still resent my mother for loving my brother more. Do I hate this life because I have these conditions, Why I Am like this, What I am not accepting or still resenting. Etc etc it goes on, you can understand the concept and generate these questions to go deeper.

The aggressive guy who said he had Depression and Anhedonia you better read this shit buddy, your salvation from these kind of diseases won't be helped by leashing your anger and frustration online on people. I understand you, I completely understand you. Because you feel anger feeling like this. ı was once there. But this is a matter of taking responsibility of yourself and trying to do anything each day. No one is coming to save you, nor your parents nor jesus nor God. I gotta say no magic cure will coming any sooner buddy. Every one of us gotta start something small and we gotta start today. I understand there are some people who are worse in their condition and I pray to god to help them more than us. Yet there are simple things in the human system that could cause these things and there are simple steps than can alleviate these hard-stricken hellish symptomps from our bodies and minds. But there are complex approaches to erase this for good. These small steps starts with " Gratitude, Awareness, Acceptance, Self-Love and Empathy" Best of Luck to all.
 
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