[Eugenie90]

I don’t know if any of you in here have been following the Idaho 4 case where Brian Kohberger recently was arrested and charged with murder. There has been a lot of speculation as to his motive and possible mental state if he is indeed guilty Turns out he has had a profile on a forum for people who suffer from visual snow, a forum called tapatalk.com, where he talks about his symptoms all the way back in 2011. It is there he also talks about his depersonalization. As someone who has struggled with chronic DPDR for 18 years I must say I relate to a lot of what he is talking about and I understand the hopelessness that comes with it. I can see that building up over time if he did not get the help he needed.
It in no way excuses murdering 4 people of course. Does anyone else have any thoughts about the case? Any hope that this case could at least be helpful in spreading awareness about how badly these symptoms can affect people and get more people the help they need.

 

[REB]

Interesting.

 

[ThoughtOnFire]

People with these conditions often report not feeling anything. Why would they say this? In my opinion, speaking of how horrible it is to not feel the love of your family/friends proves that there actually is love there. If there truly was a complete utter lack of emotions deep down there, then not having them wouldn't be something that is causing suffering. Put another way, somebody who is completely blank, emotionless and etc is not going to randomly murder four students with their entire lives ahead of them. That takes some sick and twisted shit. His mental state clearly involved something on the spectrum of psychopathy.

 

[Samzone]

I dont think this is gonna create much awareness for dp/dr. They’re just gonna label it your typical depressed psychopath who hates the world and decides to do something horrible. Also, stuff like this happens all the time in the US and the mental health problems behind it are still not being taken seriously.

Like @ThoughtOnFire said I would like to reassure anxious people reading this that this guy definitely did not murder these ppl just because of his dp. We still dont know the exact motive but you can rest assured it takes a lot more than dp/dr and depression to decide you wanna go kill people. He had a morbid fascination with murderers and likely had psychopathic tendencies even before he became ill. You need to be a special kind of scum to take out your mental suffering on other people in this way.

 

[NoDevils]

People with these conditions often report not feeling anything. Why would they say this? In my opinion, speaking of how horrible it is to not feel the love of your family/friends proves that there actually is love there. If there truly was a complete utter lack of emotions deep down there, then not having them wouldn't be something that is causing suffering. Put another way, somebody who is completely blank, emotionless and etc is not going to randomly murder four students with their entire lives ahead of them. That takes some sick and twisted shit. His mental state clearly involved something on the spectrum of psychopathy.

This is the difference between feeling like you have no emotions and not having emotions. If you in fact have zero emotions you're probably deeply unconscious or dead.

 

[Eugenie90]

I agree with both of you of course. I have had DPDR for 18 years and never once have I considered dooing anything even close to what he did. I have however been quite suicidal and at some point it seems like he also was.

he probably has other mental disorders comorbid with his DP, does not have to be psychopathy, could be BPD, NPD or PTSD. He does seem to care about the people on the forum in his other posts and his family too, talking about how he feels sad that his illness makes him an asshole towards his family.

And I definitely agree with @ThoughtOnFire about the NO EMOTIONS part. When I got DPDR i also got what I pressume to be anhedonia ( I think this is what people mean when they say they feel nothing) It does not really feel like having no emotions, more of a flattening of every feeling, sort of an inability to experience joy in the same way as before, but I can understand why people would describe this symptom as having no feelings. I don’t know if any of you can relate to the «no remorse» part he writes about as a symptom, I personally do have remorse, but I definitely experienced a dulling of my empathy when I got DPDR, kind of in the same way my emotions generally are flattened.


but yeah. I really do wonder about his motives. And what made him go from suicidal to homicidal. Definitely should have got some mental help earlier in his life tho. Maybe he did, and it never worked.

 

[Trith]

Also it's maybe not related to a problem with feeling emotions. Not all murderers are psychopaths. As long as people think what they are doing is right and they find some justifications, their emotions might not stop them, and most of the time it might be emotions that push people to commit murder. But the "no remorse" sounds different from DPDR maybe, and more with psychopathy. But a lot of people could also worry if they have enough remorse or not. I don't think an actual psychopath would worry about this though, but I'm definitely not a specialist.
And, personally, I don't think it would be beneficial to use a murderer to raise awareness about DPDR, at least in the eyes of the general public. That's how other mental disorders are stigmatized, like schizophrenia, for example.

 

[NoDevils]

Also it's maybe not related to a problem with feeling emotions. Not all murderers are psychopaths. As long as people think what they are doing is right and they find some justifications, their emotions might not stop them, and most of the time it might be emotions that push people to commit murder. But the "no remorse" sounds different from DPDR maybe, and more with psychopathy. But a lot of people could also worry if they have enough remorse or not. I don't think an actual psychopath would worry about this though, but I'm definitely not a specialist.
And, personally, I don't think it would be beneficial to use a murderer to raise awareness about DPDR, at least in the eyes of the general public. That's how other mental disorders are stigmatized, like schizophrenia, for example.

There's a kind of pop mythology about what a psychopath is. It's really just a word to describe someone born with an innate capacity to do horribly abusive or otherwise violent things in a senseless, socially unacceptable manner.

 

[NoDevils]

I don't think it matters that he had depersonalization any more than it would matter if he bad eczema unless you're a psych doctor tasked with trying to understand his motives. It's definitely interesting to see one of our fellow sufferers is a murderous psychopath but it shouldn't be surprising. Every large cohort has sick bastards like this.

 

[Eugenie90]

If anyone is interested in reading the other posts he wrote on the forum, he wrote a whole lot more, this is the link to the profile: Original Visual-Snow or Static forum

As far as I could tell from his posts in the forum he was «normal» at one point. The «no emotions» and «no remorse» seems to have come on with the illness. If that is right, it does not seem to fit with psycopathy, but I don’t doubt that he must have been predisposed in some way for What happened later, maybe he always had some out of the box personality traits, I can certainly see a need to come of as very intelligent from some of his comments in the forum.

I don’t know how the rest of you experienced onset of DPDR, but for me I also had this sort of sudden onset, which he seems to have had too. I also experienced anhedonia (loss of ability to feel joy, I am guessing this symptom is what people describe as loss of emotion) and I also had dulling of empathy. I pretty much had a major personality change when I got my DPDR

Yeah. You are right @NoDevils. It might be as relevant as eczema. There are outliers in every group. Most people would never do what he did. Mental health issues or not.

 

[Trith]

If anyone is interested in reading the other posts he wrote on the forum, he wrote a whole lot more, this is the link to the profile: Original Visual-Snow or Static forum

As far as I could tell from his posts in the forum he was «normal» at one point. The «no emotions» and «no remorse» seems to have come on with the illness. If that is right, it does not seem to fit with psycopathy, but I don’t doubt that he must have been predisposed in some way for What happened later, maybe he always had some out of the box personality traits, I can certainly see a need to come of as very intelligent from some of his comments in the forum.

I don’t know how the rest of you experienced onset of DPDR, but for me I also had this sort of sudden onset, which he seems to have had too. I also experienced anhedonia (loss of ability to feel joy, I am guessing this symptom is what people describe as loss of emotion) and I also had dulling of empathy. I pretty much had a major personality change when I got my DPDR

Yeah. You are right @NoDevils. It might be as relevant as eczema. There are outliers in every group. Most people would never do what he did. Mental health issues or not.

That's a fascinating forum. They also have their own recovery nazis. I see that this guy already posted something in 2011 preaching about "THE CURE" for visual snow, something to do with yeast infections, and when challenged he argues that "if he didn't know for sure that it worked he wouldn't share it". I guess it didn't work that well. I believe that one thing that can reduce empathy is arrogance.

 

[leminaseri]

That's a fascinating forum. They also have their own recovery nazis. I see that this guy already posted something in 2011 preaching about "THE CURE" for visual snow, something to do with yeast infections, and when challenged he argues that "if he didn't know for sure that it worked he wouldn't share it". I guess it didn't work that well. I believe that one thing that can reduce empathy is arrogance.

god why do you use the term of tdx? (recovery nazi) nobody is a recovery nazi, there are just people who dont give a fuck about dp and i mean that literally.

 

[Samzone]

As far as I could tell from his posts in the forum he was «normal» at one point. The «no emotions» and «no remorse» seems to have come on with the illness. If that is right, it does not seem to fit with psycopathy, but I don’t doubt that he must have been predisposed in some way for What happened later, maybe he always had some out of the box personality traits, I can certainly see a need to come of as very intelligent from some of his comments in the forum.

You cannot really tell without having known him personally weather he had psychopathic tendencies or not or how “normal” he truly was. These things are not apparent trough text. If anything, his arrogance in some of his post and what his classmates describe could indicate that he scores high on narcissism, one of the 3 traits in the Dark Triad. Also his strange fascination with murderers and killers to such a degree he took his education in criminal justice should tell you something.

Oh I also just read he was or used to be a heroin addict. This probably contributed much more to his actions than dp ever could, might have even been the cause of it.

 

[Dragoon909]

I have all those symptoms besides delusions.

That said, I would never murder anyone.

He definitely has depersonalization, but something else as well.

 

[forestx5]

"Creep" by radiohead.

I "celebrated" 50 years of dp/dr in December. I've been a lot of things, but never a creep that could kill innocents.

 

[Trith]

You cannot really tell without having known him personally weather he had psychopathic tendencies or not or how “normal” he truly was. These things are not apparent trough text. If anything, his arrogance in some of his post and what his classmates describe could indicate that he scores high on narcissism, one of the 3 traits in the Dark Triad. Also his strange fascination with murderers and killers to such a degree he took his education in criminal justice should tell you something.

Oh I also just read he was or used to be a heroin addict. This probably contributed much more to his actions than dp ever could, might have even been the cause of it.

I agree, but I also don't think that past heroin addiction gives people murderous tendencies (maybe some heroin addicts who are deep in it, or who are in withdrawal yes). I have met several people recovering from narcotics addiction and they seemed like fine people. Maybe tormented but definitely not murderous. But I guess he didn't look murderous either until he was.

 

[Trith]

god why do you use the term of tdx? (recovery nazi) nobody is a recovery nazi, there are just people who dont give a fuck about dp and i mean that literally.

I was just using the term to define people who really talk down to others regarding recovery, or who sound very arrogant about it, because I think it matches well. Of course nazi is a big term, but I used it like people talk about "grammar nazis" for example (even though it's different).

 

[NoDevils]

I agree, but I also don't think that past heroin addiction gives people murderous tendencies (maybe some heroin addicts who are deep in it, or who are in withdrawal yes). I have met several people recovering from narcotics addiction and they seemed like fine people. Maybe tormented but definitely not murderous. But I guess he didn't look murderous either until he was.

Everyone's heroin use is different. For some people it's not a problem and for others it destroys them.

But you've got a point. It's not a stretch to say this guy resembles a psychopath. The premeditation, apparent senselessness of the crime, and possible fascination with killers are all red flags.

I was just using the term to define people who really talk down to others regarding recovery, or who sound very arrogant about it, because I think it matches well. Of course nazi is a big term, but I used it like people talk about "grammar nazis" for example (even though it's different).

Grammar nazi only works because it's a joke. Besides, equating curemongers to nazis makes no sense. We must be in a privileged position to equate people making statements we disagree with to crimes against humanity.

 

[Peter]

Of course nazi is a big term, but I used it like people talk about "grammar nazis" for example (even though it's different).

That was my idea about the term all along. Actually I thought about the soup nazi from the comedy series Seinfeld. However I do not have any problem with people taking the word nazi literally after I have seen how these people rule over their own groups and how they behave in general. If they had a state of their own, it would be even worse than Nazi Germany.

 

[NoDevils]

That's epic. It reminds me of when Hitler said, "The cure for [normal neurological phenomenon] is to treat [obscure type of infection that might not exist] and consider trying [obscure treatment that has little to no proof of efficacy]."