[jadealexander]

Hi all,

I've just started experiencing the symptoms of depersonalization. It all really started the first time i smoked weed. I feel like i'm always high basically. But it's coupled with paranoia and anxiety. the other day I was driving and i felt like i was invincible like i could just swerve into another car and not die. I didn't feel like life was real- that it was a dream. It's been happening more often. I keep on having these episodes where I feel like i'm losing my mind and i'm not myself. I don't feel in control of my actions. I've had OCD all my life and I just started getting more in control of it, but the depersonalization is making it worse. Do these disorders usually coincide? Also, since I've started school I've been drinking a lot of coffee to stay awake, does caffeine aggravate it? Do you have any tips to help? I've started smoking ciggarettes too. It seems to help bring me back to reality. Do they actually help? Or make it worse? Please help.

 

[Xerei]

Yes, they coincide. You can say DP is like a part of OCD, usually DP\DR would just show up when you're actually anxious, but you make it a habit by thinking about it, focusing on it etc, fearing it makes it worse too. Thanks to my DP\DR I was so busy with it I didn't have any other OCD-things, when DP\DR disappeared, I guess my OCD struck for real, creating habits and sensations that aren't there, but that I bring on.

DP\DR is actually something very easy to break out of.

 

[Guest]

Yes, they coincide. You can say DP is like a part of OCD, usually DP\DR would just show up when you're actually anxious, but you make it a habit by thinking about it, focusing on it etc, fearing it makes it worse too. Thanks to my DP\DR I was so busy with it I didn't have any other OCD-things, when DP\DR disappeared, I guess my OCD struck for real, creating habits and sensations that aren't there, but that I bring on.

DP\DR is actually something very easy to break out of.

No.
OCD is an anxiety disorder characterized by obsessions and compulsions which are used to alleviate overwhelming anxiety over something such as being contaminated by germs. These disorders can interfere with your life and your work.

Someone with OCD can ALSO have the symptoms of DP/DR which I would attribute to excessive anxiety. I have a friend with OCD who also had panic attacks when under stress and then would have passing DP/DR. Once she was treated for her OCD the panic and DP/DR went away. She is on an SSRI and has been for some 26 years. Her OCD is amazingly improved -- the change was truly dramatic, after years of suffering. She has never had a panic attack or DP/DR episode since the medication kicked in. She forgot what DP/DR feels like -- completely, 26 years ago. Also, she sees a therapist to use CBT to work on when she feels her symptoms may be coming back. Stress can bring back some of the OCD symptoms, but she can more easily control them.

OCD - anxiety disorder

DP/DR - dissociative disorder

That isn't to say that we don't obsess or focus too much on our thoughts, our bodies, etc. That does ot mean we have OCD. I have some perfectionistic traits, and odd things like in college I "forgot how to swallow" for a month -- and that was attributed to being SO focused on swallowing and choking that, well, I couldn't swallow. That came on suddenly out of nowhere, and left suddently after about a month. No particular stressor.

Some people have OC Personality Disorder (a milder version of full blown OCD) -- I don't believe they are any more prone to DP/DR than someone with OCD. Such people can be extremely rigid about certain things -- how something is arranged, how others should act. (I'm not fully familiar with all of the characteristics) ... but oddly enough there can be some benefit to OC traits which are great attention to detail, organizational skills, etc. But the negative aspects should not be ignored. My friend in her worst times was praying, crossing herself hundreds of times a day as she thought she was having blasphemous thoughts. She also insisted on arranging things a certain way ... and if you moved them, she couldn't stand it. Her one sister had a serious version of this. Her other sister has no mental health issues at all.

Many people worry and obsess over things, and do not have either problem.

The addition of weed to a diagnosis of Obsessive Compulsive Disorder -- well that is an unknown variable.

My friend never smoked pot. The addition of any drug, rec or Rx, can make changes in symptom levels of all kinds but DP is "not a part of OCD." Many have OCD and never have DP/DR, ever.

Most commonly associated disorders with DP/DR are panic attacks, high levels of stress/anxiety, lack of sleep, and Borderline Personality Disorder. And as has been observed by Sierra and Simeon, etc., conastant verbal abuse from a young age can trigger this in individuals predisposed to dissociate under stress.

 

[Xerei]

No.
OCD is an anxiety disorder characterized by obsessions and compulsions which are used to alleviate overwhelming anxiety over something such as being contaminated by germs. These disorders can interfere with your life and your work.

Someone with OCD can ALSO have the symptoms of DP/DR which I would attribute to excessive anxiety. I have a friend with OCD who also had panic attacks when under stress and then would have passing DP/DR. Once she was treated for her OCD the panic and DP/DR went away. She is on an SSRI and has been for some 26 years. Her OCD is amazingly improved -- the change was truly dramatic, after years of suffering. She has never had a panic attack or DP/DR episode since the medication kicked in. She forgot what DP/DR feels like -- completely, 26 years ago. Also, she sees a therapist to use CBT to work on when she feels her symptoms may be coming back. Stress can bring back some of the OCD symptoms, but she can more easily control them.

OCD - anxiety disorder

DP/DR - dissociative disorder

That isn't to say that we don't obsess or focus too much on our thoughts, our bodies, etc. That does ot mean we have OCD. I have some perfectionistic traits, and odd things like in college I "forgot how to swallow" for a month -- and that was attributed to being SO focused on swallowing and choking that, well, I couldn't swallow. That came on suddenly out of nowhere, and left suddently after about a month. No particular stressor.

Some people have OC Personality Disorder (a milder version of full blown OCD) -- I don't believe they are any more prone to DP/DR than someone with OCD. Such people can be extremely rigid about certain things -- how something is arranged, how others should act. (I'm not fully familiar with all of the characteristics) ... but oddly enough there can be some benefit to OC traits which are great attention to detail, organizational skills, etc. But the negative aspects should not be ignored. My friend in her worst times was praying, crossing herself hundreds of times a day as she thought she was having blasphemous thoughts. She also insisted on arranging things a certain way ... and if you moved them, she couldn't stand it. Her one sister had a serious version of this. Her other sister has no mental health issues at all.

Many people worry and obsess over things, and do not have either problem.

The addition of weed to a diagnosis of Obsessive Compulsive Disorder -- well that is an unknown variable.

My friend never smoked pot. The addition of any drug, rec or Rx, can make changes in symptom levels of all kinds but DP is "not a part of OCD." Many have OCD and never have DP/DR, ever.

Most commonly associated disorders with DP/DR are panic attacks, high levels of stress/anxiety, lack of sleep, and Borderline Personality Disorder. And as has been observed by Sierra and Simeon, etc., conastant verbal abuse from a young age can trigger this in individuals predisposed to dissociate under stress.

You act like DP\DR is a disorder and a disease in itself. it isn't, quit deluding yourself. And I believe coincide means they can basically work together\be together?

 

[Swansea]

I think DP/DR can be an effect of an anxiety disorder, depression, etc. Be co-morbid. Or be its own illness all by itself.

 

[Xerei]

I think DP/DR can be an effect of an anxiety disorder, depression, etc. Be co-morbid. Or be its own illness all by itself.

Treat the symptom, not the disease?

 

[Guest]

Treat the symptom, not the disease?

You don't seem to be familiar with the history of the dissociative disorders or the classifiction of DPD as now a separate entity unto itself. It is also now called Depersonalization/Derealization Syndrome. You need to read PubMed articles, talk to other DPers in person and read some medical textbooks. This isn't something someone just made up. DP has been around for centuries. You need to read Steinberg, Abugel, Simeon, and Sierra at minimum. Also, if you study liturature or speak with someone with OCD you will understand the difference. I'm not making this up out of thin air.

It can be a symptom of a lot of things, incuding stroke. The feeling of unreality can occur during a stroke in someone who has never experienced it before. If it remains after the stroke, the individual has chronic DPD as a result of the stroke. So it is known in neurology, not just psychiatry, etc.

Also, fascinating article I'll post elsewhere, but I KNEW dizziness was connected to this. When this really hit me hard I had a terrible dizzy spell BEFORE the onset. Several days of being very dizzy. I also have dizziness on and off. And I get bad vertigo now and again. I always thought it might be associated with anxiety (panicking) or with inner ear problems, but this 2013 article seems to indcate otherwise. "Fascinating" as Mr. Spock would say.

------------------------
J Nerv Ment Dis. 2013 Jul;201(7):629-35. doi: 10.1097/NMD.0b013e3182982995.
Depersonalization experiences are strongly associated with dizziness and vertigo symptoms leading to increased health care consumption in the German general population.
Tschan R, Wiltink J, Adler J, Beutel ME, Michal M.

Source
Department of Psychosomatic Medicine and Psychotherapy, University Medical Center Mainz, Mainz, Germany.

Abstract
This study investigated the association of depersonalization (DP) experiences with dizziness and its impact on subjective impairment and health care use.

Trained interviewers surveyed a representative sample of 1287 persons using standardized self-rating questionnaires on dizziness, DP, and mental distress. Symptoms of dizziness were reported by 15.8% (n = 201). Thereof, 62.7% endorsed at least one symptom of DP, 40% reported impairment by symptoms of DP, and 8.5% reported clinically significant DP.

Regression analyses identified DP as a significant, independent predictor for dizziness symptom severity, health care use, and impairment by dizziness.

With regard to the Vertigo Symptom Scale, DP explained 34.1% (p < 0.001) of the variance for severity of symptoms of dysfunction in the balance system. In conclusion, symptoms of DP, highly prevalent in patients complaining of dizziness and vertigo, were independently associated with increased impairment and health care use. The presence of DP symptoms should actively be explored in patients complaining of dizziness.
PMID:
23817161
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
--------------------------

Cheers

LC

 

[Xerei]

You don't seem to be familiar with the history of the dissociative disorders or the classifiction of DPD as now a separate entity unto itself. It is also now called Depersonalization/Derealization Syndrome. You need to read PubMed articles, talk to other DPers in person and read some medical textbooks. This isn't something someone just made up. DP has been around for centuries. You need to read Steinberg, Abugel, Simeon, and Sierra at minimum. Also, if you study liturature or speak with someone with OCD you will understand the difference. I'm not making this up out of thin air.

It can be a symptom of a lot of things, incuding stroke. The feeling of unreality can occur during a stroke in someone who has never experienced it before. If it remains after the stroke, the individual has chronic DPD as a result of the stroke. So it is known in neurology, not just psychiatry, etc.

Also, fascinating article I'll post elsewhere, but I KNEW dizziness was connected to this. When this really hit me hard I had a terrible dizzy spell BEFORE the onset. Several days of being very dizzy. I also have dizziness on and off. And I get bad vertigo now and again. I always thought it might be associated with anxiety (panicking) or with inner ear problems, but this 2013 article seems to indcate otherwise. "Fascinating" as Mr. Spock would say.

------------------------
J Nerv Ment Dis. 2013 Jul;201(7):629-35. doi: 10.1097/NMD.0b013e3182982995.
Depersonalization experiences are strongly associated with dizziness and vertigo symptoms leading to increased health care consumption in the German general population.
Tschan R, Wiltink J, Adler J, Beutel ME, Michal M.

Source
Department of Psychosomatic Medicine and Psychotherapy, University Medical Center Mainz, Mainz, Germany.

Abstract
This study investigated the association of depersonalization (DP) experiences with dizziness and its impact on subjective impairment and health care use.

Trained interviewers surveyed a representative sample of 1287 persons using standardized self-rating questionnaires on dizziness, DP, and mental distress. Symptoms of dizziness were reported by 15.8% (n = 201). Thereof, 62.7% endorsed at least one symptom of DP, 40% reported impairment by symptoms of DP, and 8.5% reported clinically significant DP.

Regression analyses identified DP as a significant, independent predictor for dizziness symptom severity, health care use, and impairment by dizziness.

With regard to the Vertigo Symptom Scale, DP explained 34.1% (p < 0.001) of the variance for severity of symptoms of dysfunction in the balance system. In conclusion, symptoms of DP, highly prevalent in patients complaining of dizziness and vertigo, were independently associated with increased impairment and health care use. The presence of DP symptoms should actively be explored in patients complaining of dizziness.
PMID:
23817161
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
--------------------------

Cheers

LC

I'm very well familiar with the history of DP, you're not the only one who has read it etc. I've spent years suffering from it and researching it. I simply refuse to see it as a disorder when it's as simple as a symptom. Treating a symptom gets you nowhere. If you have an infection, treating the fever might make you think you're better, but in all reality you're worse off if you try to fight off a defensive mechanism, not the disease. I see you pull up stroke etc out of your ass, how many here has had a stroke? A lot of the people here have had extensive medical checkups etc, nothing wrong found. But yeah, keep trying to cure the symptom and not the disease, I'll just close it with one line "Enjoy your DP"