How can DP be our mind's way of coping when it's HELL??? What exactly is this shit protecting me from?? Where is the mechanism to help me cope with this terror I live in everyday?? Now maybe if it made me numb I could understand. I wouldn't feel anything. But this DP=Fear and Pain and Suffering and it doesn't help me cope with shit.
Coping Mechanism My Ass
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LOL.peacedove said:
Sorry to laugh, but my sentiments exactly.
My sense it is a coping mechanism GONE BAD. A normal mechanism that is malfunctioning. Or it is a weird perceptual shift, that could be related to anything from extremely low-level seizure activity, to problems with brain input and output (external and internal), also with perception of self. A cognitive/perceptual/who knows what sort of problem that yes is exacerbated by psychological issues/stress, etc.
To much evidence in those directions.
In my extremely humble opinion.
I think it's a coping mechanism -- gone BAD, BAD, BAD. It isn't supposed to do this. It went awry.
Not making fun of you, peacedove, just liked how you put it. 8)
That's what I was gonna say. It's a normal function, but the on-off switch is broken. Sort of like how your bones are supposed to grow as you're growing up, but they're supposed to stop at some point. You aren't supposed to end up like the kid in Mask. No, it's not protecting us from anything, and we have no reason at all to be thankful that it's there.
Sorry if I'm posting too much today. I've been waiting on trick-or-treaters. We've had ONE group, so I've had way too much time to kill.
Sorry if I'm posting too much today. I've been waiting on trick-or-treaters. We've had ONE group, so I've had way too much time to kill.
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The hell comes when we try to live a normal life, but dp keeps trying to "protect" us.
But for people who experience dp in a traumatic situation--such as being raped, or being in a car accident, or saving someone's life in an emergency--it is a blessing.
But for people who experience dp in a traumatic situation--such as being raped, or being in a car accident, or saving someone's life in an emergency--it is a blessing.
Chronic, long term DP is, as Dreamer said, our natural coping mechanism gone bad. Short term, reactive DP, is probably a good thing. It saves us from our brain exploding when we are faced with major trauma.
Why some people get 'stuck' in long term DP is an utter mystery to me. Apart from wild theories of learned behaviour and brain damage, does anyone have a clue?
Why some people get 'stuck' in long term DP is an utter mystery to me. Apart from wild theories of learned behaviour and brain damage, does anyone have a clue?
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some people are just naturally wired to the sky
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HA, exactly!
Here is Dr. V.S. Ramachandran's theory again. I buy it. He is an evolutionary psychiatrist ... that isn't the exact term ... but I believe in evolution/adaptation. His BBC lectures were superb, they are summarized in his book A Brief Tour of Human Consciousness -- a superb read.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/reith2003/lecture5.shtml
An excellent discussion of this by V.S. Ramachandran. This was discussed in the BBC Reith lectures and this is the transcript. The Lectures were adapted and made into the book "A Brief Tour of Human Consciousness"
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/reith2003/lecture5.shtml
If you read nothing else, read this.
..... from Ramachandran's lecture... see link to all lectures....
"Now Capgras and Cotard are both rare syndromes. But there's another disorder, a sort of mini-Cotard's that's much more commonly seen in clinical practice (those of you here who are psychiatrists know this, or psychologists). It's called Derealisation and Depersonalisation. It's seen in acute anxiety, panic attacks, depression and other dissociative states. Suddenly the world seems completely unreal - like a dream. Or you may feel that you are not real - Doctor, I feel like a zombie. Why does this happen? As I said, it's quite common.
I think it involves the same circuits as Capgras and Cotard's. You've all heard of the phrase, playing possum. An opossum when chased by a predator suddenly loses all muscle tone and plays dead. Why? This is because any movement by the possum will encourage the predatory behaviour of the carnivore - and carnivores also avoid dead infected food. So playing dead is very adaptive for the possum.
Following the lead of Martin Roth and Sierra and Berrios, I suggested Derealisation and Depersonalisation and other dissociative states are an example of playing possum in the emotional realm. And I'll explain. It's an evolutionary adaptive mechanism. Remember the story of Livingstone being mauled by a lion.
He saw his arm being ripped off but felt no pain or even fear. He felt like he was detached from it all, watching it all happen. The same thing happens, by the way, to soldiers in battle or sometimes even to women being raped. During such dire emergencies, the anterior cingular in the brain, part of the frontal lobes, becomes extremely active. This inhibits or temporarily shuts down your amygdala and other limbic emotional centres, so you suppress potentially disabling emotions like anxiety and fear - temporarily. But at the same time, the anterior cingular makes you extremely alert and vigilant so you can take the appropriate action.
Now of course in an emergency this combination of shutting down emotions and being hyper-vigilant at the same time is useful, keeping you out of harm's way. It's best to do nothing than engage in some sort of erratic behaviour. But what if the same mechanism is accidentally triggered by chemical imbalances or brain disease, when there is no emergency. You look at the world, you're intensely alert, hyper-vigilant, but it's completely devoid of emotional meaning because you've shut down your limbic system. And there are only two ways for you to interpret this dilemma. Either you say the world isn't real - and that's called Derealisation. Or you say, I'm not real, I feel empty - and that's called Depersonalisation.
Epileptic seizures originating in this part of the brain can also produce these dreamy states of Deralisation and Depersonalisation. And, intriguingly, we know that during the actual seizure when the patient is experiencing Derealisation, you can obtain a Galvanic Skin Response and there's no response to anything. But once he comes out of the seizure, fine, he's normal. And all of this supports the hypothesis that I'm proposing."
V.S. Ramachandran, M.D., Ph.D.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/reith2003/lecture5.shtml
An excellent discussion of this by V.S. Ramachandran. This was discussed in the BBC Reith lectures and this is the transcript. The Lectures were adapted and made into the book "A Brief Tour of Human Consciousness"
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/reith2003/lecture5.shtml
If you read nothing else, read this.
..... from Ramachandran's lecture... see link to all lectures....
"Now Capgras and Cotard are both rare syndromes. But there's another disorder, a sort of mini-Cotard's that's much more commonly seen in clinical practice (those of you here who are psychiatrists know this, or psychologists). It's called Derealisation and Depersonalisation. It's seen in acute anxiety, panic attacks, depression and other dissociative states. Suddenly the world seems completely unreal - like a dream. Or you may feel that you are not real - Doctor, I feel like a zombie. Why does this happen? As I said, it's quite common.
I think it involves the same circuits as Capgras and Cotard's. You've all heard of the phrase, playing possum. An opossum when chased by a predator suddenly loses all muscle tone and plays dead. Why? This is because any movement by the possum will encourage the predatory behaviour of the carnivore - and carnivores also avoid dead infected food. So playing dead is very adaptive for the possum.
Following the lead of Martin Roth and Sierra and Berrios, I suggested Derealisation and Depersonalisation and other dissociative states are an example of playing possum in the emotional realm. And I'll explain. It's an evolutionary adaptive mechanism. Remember the story of Livingstone being mauled by a lion.
He saw his arm being ripped off but felt no pain or even fear. He felt like he was detached from it all, watching it all happen. The same thing happens, by the way, to soldiers in battle or sometimes even to women being raped. During such dire emergencies, the anterior cingular in the brain, part of the frontal lobes, becomes extremely active. This inhibits or temporarily shuts down your amygdala and other limbic emotional centres, so you suppress potentially disabling emotions like anxiety and fear - temporarily. But at the same time, the anterior cingular makes you extremely alert and vigilant so you can take the appropriate action.
Now of course in an emergency this combination of shutting down emotions and being hyper-vigilant at the same time is useful, keeping you out of harm's way. It's best to do nothing than engage in some sort of erratic behaviour. But what if the same mechanism is accidentally triggered by chemical imbalances or brain disease, when there is no emergency. You look at the world, you're intensely alert, hyper-vigilant, but it's completely devoid of emotional meaning because you've shut down your limbic system. And there are only two ways for you to interpret this dilemma. Either you say the world isn't real - and that's called Derealisation. Or you say, I'm not real, I feel empty - and that's called Depersonalisation.
Epileptic seizures originating in this part of the brain can also produce these dreamy states of Deralisation and Depersonalisation. And, intriguingly, we know that during the actual seizure when the patient is experiencing Derealisation, you can obtain a Galvanic Skin Response and there's no response to anything. But once he comes out of the seizure, fine, he's normal. And all of this supports the hypothesis that I'm proposing."
V.S. Ramachandran, M.D., Ph.D.
The bells at Notre Dame still silent, LOL.
Ramachandran is a neurologist really, but his credentials are astonishing. He is the researcher of the future into all of this. Located at UC San Diego and affiliated with various organizations.
He did extensive work into Phantom Limbs. This is very pertinent to our experience of our "phantom selves" in many ways.
I also recommend his book "Phantoms in the Brain".
IMHO the man is brilliant.
I'm a Ramachandrian 8)
He is sort of a new Oliver Sacks, M.D. -- only better. (Sorry Oliver. I'm a fan of his as well. Also a neurologist.)
Ramachandran is a neurologist really, but his credentials are astonishing. He is the researcher of the future into all of this. Located at UC San Diego and affiliated with various organizations.
He did extensive work into Phantom Limbs. This is very pertinent to our experience of our "phantom selves" in many ways.
I also recommend his book "Phantoms in the Brain".
IMHO the man is brilliant.
I'm a Ramachandrian 8)
He is sort of a new Oliver Sacks, M.D. -- only better. (Sorry Oliver. I'm a fan of his as well. Also a neurologist.)
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that made me chuckle, dreamer!
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omg dreamer, that picture is classic. it really shows just how detached the doctor was from that situation. its almost like hes saying, "dude, im not into beastiality leave me alone."
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