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#353715 Tinnitus?

Posted by *Dreamer* on 16 June 2015 - 04:48 PM in Introduce Yourself

Hey guys,

did any of you have problem with tinnitus? Is it related to anxiety/depression? I asked my doctor she was like maybe it's just me tripping. But it's not stoping,mostly when im laying and trying to sleep. I have dp/dr and tinnitus too and on some forumes i saw its typical for psychosis,so now im more nervous.. And dp is pretty bad these days so it's scary,i can't relax.. Hope someone will relate to this

Firstly, I'm not sure why you say due to tripping ... have you taken rec drugs?
Also, this is not a sign of psychosis.

inferential police gave some great links.
There has been a long term debate over DP/DR being related to some form of vestibular disorder.

I can tell you now, when under stress my entire life since childhood, I have had balance problems.
As I have gotten older I have had severe tinnitus clearly related to stress.
Now for the past month I had horrible vertigo.  During that time I had tinnitus come and go.

My tinnitus is basically ringing, not some of the other dramtic symptoms others experience.
I would say at minium it can be related to anxiety.

Here is another great article.  I am going for tests re: my vertigo on Thurdsay.  I want to give this info to my ENT, but before I do I want him to NOT be aware of my anxiety, DP/DR.  I DO have a problem, most likely BPPV that individuals can develop with age.  I'm 56.  I am literally hoping it is not "of unknown cause" which means there is little treatment. I would rather it be a benign tumor or something!

Here is another interesting article. I can't find the link.  You are NOT psychotic however. And it may be as simple as the a possiblity that you just have tinnitus.  People without any issues have it as well.  I volunteer with a woman who has vertigo and tinnitus and no emotional disorders at all.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
J Nerv Ment Dis. 2013 Jul;201(7):629-35. doi: 10.1097/NMD.0b013e3182982995.
Depersonalization experiences are strongly associated with dizziness and vertigo symptoms leading to increased health care consumption in the German general population.
Tschan R, Wiltink J, Adler J, Beutel ME, Michal M.

Source
Department of Psychosomatic Medicine and Psychotherapy, University Medical Center Mainz, Mainz, Germany.

Abstract
This study investigated the association of depersonalization (DP) experiences with dizziness and its impact on subjective impairment and health care use.

Trained interviewers surveyed a representative sample of 1287 persons using standardized self-rating questionnaires on dizziness, DP, and mental distress. Symptoms of dizziness were reported by 15.8% (n = 201). Thereof, 62.7% endorsed at least one symptom of DP, 40% reported impairment by symptoms of DP, and 8.5% reported clinically significant DP.

Regression analyses identified DP as a significant, independent predictor for dizziness symptom severity, health care use, and impairment by dizziness. With regard to the Vertigo Symptom Scale, DP explained 34.1% (p < 0.001) of the variance for severity of symptoms of dysfunction in the balance system. In conclusion, symptoms of DP, highly prevalent in patients complaining of dizziness and vertigo, were independently associated with increased impairment and health care use.

The presence of DP symptoms should actively be explored in patients complaining of dizziness.

PMID:
23817161
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

----------------------------

When this board was first established in 1997, DP/DR and vestibular disorders were being discussed.  So this has been resaerched on and off for almost 20 years.  I wish they could figure this stuff out.  And again, I see a neurological component regardless of how this started.
I had a severly dysfuncitonal family where I was under stress all the time.  Most of the time.
It's amazing I'm still around, LOL.
Hang in.




#352853 Nitrous Oxide AKA Laughing Gas

Posted by *Dreamer* on 26 May 2015 - 10:12 AM in Discussion

I told my dentist (even past dentists) that I have DP and DR.  They know what that is, or what "dissociation" is as they give drugs that cause you to dissociate.  Surgeons also know about this as they may give ketamine during surgery.

I will never let a dentist give me "twilight sleep" ... or any procedure that requires that ... say cataract removal.

You can ask for a short acting benzo if you tolerate it, but I also ask for lidocaine -- local anesthetic.

Granted the oldy good part of my body is my teeth, LOL.  I have had only one crown, and cavities filled.

IMHO.  I have heard people say when they wake up from dental work, "Is this the real world?" -- there is a video (which I find rather mean) of a father capturing his son's experience after dental work where "twightlight sleep" was used.  Granted kids squirm all over the place.

The kid was carrying on for a while, and I know he was briefly experiencing DP.  Thing is for him it passed.

Anyone who has a greater tendency to dissociate -- I woulld ask for local numbing stuff -- it really works.  Don't feel any pain, but you hear sounds, etc.  I'll take that any day.

  If there is something major you need done -- such as wisdom teeth they will knock you out cold -- propafol these days I think.

Take Care.




#352696 Use Stress to Your Advantage

Posted by *Dreamer* on 22 May 2015 - 10:11 AM in Mental & Physical Health

Sunjet, I appreciate the struggles you've been through, and it's terrifying to say that the Mental Health Care system in the US is very bad and we have similar problems.  Mainly the problem is, "mental illness isn't real" ... something you say below. 

 

I just stayed strong, avoided all drugs and get over this shit, even if it was severe.

 

PS : I'm not talking about real mental illnesses like schizo, bipolar, manias and others real serious mental disorders, i'm talking about idiophatic/psychogenic anxiety/DPDR any degree.

 

More and more research worldwide has proven that extreme anxiety is a medical condition.  It is disabling.  It can be treated many ways - and obviously the first choice would to be to go without medications and try all sorts of alternatives.
If these things fail, it is up to the individual to decide if they wish to take meds or not.

So we can't agree that SEVERE anxiety and DP/DR are medical conditions.  In your case with a panic disorder ... I believe that is a medical condition and DP/DR is  KNOWN listed secondary syndrome.  I have friends who know DP/DR as they have had panic attacks.

Some friends were given short courses of meds, then tapered off and have never had an episode again.  One friend with OCD as well as panic attacks has been on an SSRI for years now.  The panic attacks stopped as did the DP/DR episodes, but her OCD is controlled -- very well.   When she was pregnant she went off the SSRI.  During both of her pregnancies all of her symptoms came back in full force.  During her last pregnancy it was suggested even by her OB/GYN that she stay on an SSRI (the child is fine) as she was in such agony with all of her psychiatric symptoms.

Again I don't see you showing compassion.  I fear you would say to a patient with an anxiety disorder as "weak."  You would apply only YOUR experience, "Well I got over it.  Snap out of it!  You are weak."

It's interesting that this is indeed what many doctors believe.

Also, I despise the word "schizo" and your description of the inpatients you saw as "veggies" ... that shows a lack of compassion and empathy.

I really hope you are planning to become a surgeon and not work in any field of internal medicine.

I'm glad you are better, but please don't judge others here or any other people in your life.  You said, no one believed you. So you would repeat this with a friend or patient in the future?

Unfortuante, but that is the nature of our world.  So many do not believe even in schizohrenia.  Or they are afraid to talk about it.  You are adding to the probelm and not the solution and you plan to be a doctor.  That really terrifies me.

But I'm glad you are doing so much better.


 




#352625 Use Stress to Your Advantage

Posted by *Dreamer* on 20 May 2015 - 03:13 PM in Mental & Physical Health

NB: this is at the University of Michigan. Since 2004 I have been through about 11 M.D. psychiatric residents, and I ask them the same questions. Some are happy to learn from me.  Others become defensive and then abusive -- and I ask for another -- some are fired thank God.  Amazing the differece in the attitude of the excellent doctors.




#352624 Use Stress to Your Advantage

Posted by *Dreamer* on 20 May 2015 - 03:06 PM in Mental & Physical Health

sunjet, on 14 May 2015 - 03:52 AM, said:snapback.png -- this was in response to a questoin about IV resperidone.

I made a rotation through psychward for 1-2 weeks and all patients who had Risperidone where just some veggies that don't care about anything. It's just numbs you totally and you are like a walking zombie.

 

My thought that this med is good for those with intrusive hallucinations, strong psychotic outbreak and who are really going mad.

 

I wouldn't recommend taking it for DPDR no matter how severe is. Better find a good anxiolytic or/and antidepressant.

First, to answer the OP's question, I also would be hesitant to go with IV vs. attempting to take this orally.  It could very well help, but my experience with old antipsychotics has been a horrible increase in my DP/DR.

And to Sunjet, your description as a medical student on rotation through a psych ward is unbelievably cruel, especially for someone who has some form of brain disorder.  I know (my parents were physicians, and I've heard this from medical residents) that doctors in all specialties, on the whole, look down with disdain on psychiatric patients, without compassion, and don't seem to understand that such individuals can be terribly sick and yet go into remission and be highly funcioning members of society.

I know indiviuals who have been hospitalized for psychosis (schizophrenia, schizoaffective, etc.) and have been given all manner of such medications.  Yes, they may feel doped up and LOOK doped up.  That doesn't mean they aren't sad, terrified, anxious, lonely, and deserve respect.

It is painful to hear that you have no empathy with your OWN experience.

Yes, this medication could really dope you out, but you aren't a vegetable, not knowing what's going on. You are a human being who has been given a drug to help you (all that is available now) that also makes you feel terrible.  That's true of chemotherapy.  Would you have no sympathy for someone undergoing therapy who is so zonked out they can't see straight?

There is a human being inside every person with mental illness.

One friend of mine, who works full time, and better than I do, took 12 years to fight a psychotic break.  In the hospital, drugged to the hilt, she was still aware of what was going on.  She wanted to die as she was so frightened, so frightend the medication wouldn't work.  She was even discharged one time when her ability to hold her bag of belongings in her arms and take a cab home was virtually impossible.  She couldn't tell the taxi driver where she lived even though she knew she had forgotten, and it was due to her being loaded up with meds and discharged because the doctors needed to empty the ward for another patient -- before she was ready to leave.

 

Oh, forgot to mention, when said friend was "let go" in a few days she attempted suicide.  She would have been dead had someone not looked for her 24 hours later.  She doesn't know how she survived. When she went BACK into the hospital one doctor told her, "What a foolish thing to do."  She shouldn't be alive, and she is thank God.  She is an inspiration to so many.

Don't judge someone without walking in his/her shoes.

To add to this.  A rotation of 1-2 weeks through psychiatry is NOTHING.  I have found brilliant young residents in psychiatry, and some true idiots that everyone was happy to see leave and move on.  My current psychiatrist knows about DP/DR.  She is 28 or so.  She is working her clinical residency and has worked with inpatients as well.  She would NEVER talk the way you do. Her specialty is psychiatry and she wishes to go on into geriatrci psychiatry.

Fellowship and further study.

I have found the therapists  from MSW to ACSW who hang around a long time, and the nurses have tremendous compassion. They spend TIME with patients ... a lot of time.  And you base this on a "1-2 week rotation?"

I doubt you plan to go into psychiatry.  But I hope whatever specialty you choose you don't treat individuals with mental illness like crap.
End of lecture.  I have seen and heard to much about this.




#352623 Use Stress to Your Advantage

Posted by *Dreamer* on 20 May 2015 - 02:58 PM in Mental & Physical Health

And here we go, someone else confirm that it's not anxiety/depression/dpdr that affects us, it's our REACTION to it. 

Stress can indeed be positive to a degree.  There would be no anxiety instinct in animals (and I see us as complex animals) if it didn't serve some purpose.  It protects us in dangerous situations ... a survival mechanism ... fight/flight.  And it is normal for a healthy person to feel anxious and vigilant when going down a dark alley at night.  Being focused, hyperaware, etc. That is live-saving.

But when anxiety is pathological -- and it is the most common mental health disorder -- it can be paralyzing.

There are ways to alleviate the suffering of chronic anxiety ... and of course it occurs on a spectrum.  But it is too simple to say an attitude alone is going to make a difference.

I have mentally healthy friends who have extremely high stress jobs -- entertainment industry, finance (handling million dollar accounts), doctors under constant pressure.  Most have no idea what I'm talking about when I talk about the level of daily anxiety I have, not to mention serious anxiety.  I will ask over and over -- "What makes you anxious?"  It takes them a long time to find any example.  Generally for many it is "first time on a job" or a "job evaluation" or maybe "giving a presentation." And many people with severe anxiety force themselves and are able to "push through" serious anxiety ... but they are subject to burnout.

Also, anxiety comes with most mental illness.

I see MD resident psychiatrists who rotate out every year -- they are in charge of my meds.  I have an ACSW thearpist who is a permanent member of the staff.  I have yet to find a psychitrist who had experienced the level of anxiety I have ...

One wonderful guy said he had experienced DP/DR.  He had been up for 48+ hours in the ER.  He felt he didn't know what he was doing when a serious trauma came in.  As he was trying to figure out what to do, he felt severe DP/DR.  He had to work through it, but could barely function and a nurse coached him.  When he took a break and went to sleep for a few hours he was OK.  Never came back.  He said to me "OMG how can you live with this chronically?"  That happened to him once or twice.  He knew the ER was not the place for him.  No shame in that.

I believe you are a medical resident Sunjet?  I wrote a response to you in one place where I am really surprised by your lack of empathy for psychiatric patients.  And it is a fact that doctors frequently look down on individuals with mental illness even when they come in with serious medical conditions.
I have been insulted, "babied" and worse by many doctors.  One PATTED ME ON THE HEAD.

I will give the link to my response in another place.  You may have not read it.  It really troubles me if you plan to be a doctor of any kind and have such little compassion.  I work with mentally ill individuals daily and they all have the same story.  And some residents are honest with me and note that mentally ill patients are discussed and joiked about.  My mother was a psychiatrist -- she did the same thing -- made fun of her patients in front of me, even when I was a young girl.




#352514 https://youtu.be/nPUYLzJla5Y MAN CURED!!!

Posted by *Dreamer* on 17 May 2015 - 03:19 PM in Depersonalization & Media

Link doesn't work.




#352435 Seriously debating a Risperidone injection

Posted by *Dreamer* on 14 May 2015 - 07:58 PM in Discussion

I made a rotation through psychward for 1-2 weeks and all patients who had Risperidone where just some veggies that don't care about anything. It's just numbs you totally and you are like a walking zombie.

 

My thought that this med is good for those with intrusive hallucinations, strong psychotic outbreak and who are really going mad.

 

I wouldn't recommend taking it for DPDR no matter how severe is. Better find a good anxiolytic or/and antidepressant.

First, to answer the OP's question, I also would be hesitant to go with IV vs. attempting to take this orally.  It could very well help, but my experience with old antipsychotics has been a horrible increase in my DP/DR.

And to Sunjet, your description as a medical student on rotation through a psych ward is unbelievably cruel, especially for someone who has some form of brain disorder.  I know (my parents were physicians, and I've heard this from medical residents) that doctors in all specialties, on the whole, look down with disdain on psychiatric patients, without compassion, and don't seem to understand that such individuals can be terribly sick and yet go into remission and be highly funcioning members of society.

I know indiviuals who have been hospitalized for psychosis (schizophrenia, schizoaffective, etc.) and have been given all manner of such medications.  Yes, they may feel doped up and LOOK doped up.  That doesn't mean they aren't sad, terrified, anxious, lonely, and deserve respect.

It is painful to hear that you have no empathy with your OWN experience.

Yes, this medication could really dope you out, but you aren't a vegetable, not knowing what's going on. You are a human being who has been given a drug to help you (all that is available now) that also makes you feel terrible.  That's true of chemotherapy.  Would you have no sympathy for someone undergoing therapy who is so zonked out they can't see straight?

There is a human being inside every person with mental illness.

One friend of mine, who works full time, and better than I do, took 12 years to fight a psychotic break.  In the hospital, drugged to the hilt, she was still aware of what was going on.  She wanted to die as she was so frightened, so frightend the medication wouldn't work.  She was even discharged one time when her ability to hold her bag of belongings in her arms and take a cab home was virtually impossible.  She couldn't tell the taxi driver where she lived even though she knew she had forgotten, and it was due to her being loaded up with meds and discharged because the doctors needed to empty the ward for another patient -- before she was ready to leave.

Don't judge someone without walking in his/her shoes.




#352343 John77's suggestion

Posted by *Dreamer* on 11 May 2015 - 04:57 PM in Discussion

See this thread, and another theory of DP/DR ... just scroll down to the last two posts.
 

http://www.dpselfhel...-dpdr-symptoms/

 

Sample .... more in the last post ....

Altered Circuits May Cause ‘Out-Of-Body’ Symptoms in Some People with PTSD
May 01, 2015

Margaret McKinnon, Ph.D. For some people with post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), symptoms go beyond the flashbacks, nightmares, sleeplessness, and tense feelings that trouble many. Up to 30 percent of people with PTSD also suffer from symptoms known as depersonalization and de-realization––that is, they experience “out-of-body” episodes or feelings that the world is not real. These disturbances to awareness and consciousness are known as dissociation.
New research now reveals that brain circuits involved in fear processing are wired differently in these people than in others diagnosed with PTSD. The findings, reported in Neuropsychopharmacology, suggest that such patients need different treatment options.

 

.....
Some people with depression do not even respond to medication or any treatment for depression or other mental illnesses; you really can't make a generalization from yourself to everyone else, even though it is great you are doing so much better.




#352341 John77's suggestion

Posted by *Dreamer* on 11 May 2015 - 04:55 PM in Discussion

John, it's  great this worked for you, but it doesn't work for everyone.  Anyone with depression, anxiety, ocd, basically any mental disorder can experience DP/DR as part of the illness.  So different types of medication sometimes help the symptoms of DP/DR, or can make them worse.

One person who really understands DP/DR in my "real life" is a friend who has a psychotic disorder (not clearly diagnosed) and that disorder is in remission.  She has a variety of medications, none of which are antidepressants.  She also uses "every tool in the toolbox" -- therapy, exercise, diet, socializing, working, mindfulness, etc., etc.  EDIT: My friend originally didn't have DP/DR until some years into her illness. Then it "switched on and off light a lightswitch" -- ultimately with a change in anit-psychotic medication it "switched off" completely.  However every few months, it creeps up, and she has to focus away from it. It is not chronic and will sometimes pass on its own. Mine has been chronic for essentially 50 years.  And believe me, I have tried every med, and form of therapy, exercise, lifestyle, etc. My primary diagnosis is DP DISORDER.  Not DP as secondary.

There are many individuals I have known over the years who have SECONDARY DP/DR as a symptom, and others whose primary problem is DP/DR.  For me that is the case. Also no medication is a cure.  It is considered that mental disorders improve greatly, or are in remission.

I'll again posted the latest interesting finding on DP/DR as sort of an inverse symptom of true PTSD.
See my website about me and my experience.  56, still DP/DR ... a helluva lot of verbal abuse ... and no internet, not the same meds available to me when I was a young person.  I was diagnosed immediately in 1975 with depression, anxiety and DP/DR and was told by my M.D. psychiatrist at the time that "DP is incurable."  That cut me to the core.  He was about 45 years old.  Very respected psychiatrist.

Every case is unique to each individual.




#352267 Word Salad

Posted by *Dreamer* on 09 May 2015 - 01:15 PM in The Daily Forum

Simple examples of word salad.

"Computers smelling bunny's talking deliciously today."

"I want to go to the store, the store, I store the big stuff there.  I need paper newspapers. These are reading, ringing, rapping.  Am I rapping or napping?"

Examples of word salad in psychosis.  This also occurs in Alzheimer's and other brain disorders such as stroke.
 




#352266 Hemispheric Approach to understand DPDR symptoms

Posted by *Dreamer* on 09 May 2015 - 01:09 PM in Research

Interesting, but this comes from a layperson's blog. Recent research from the Brain and Behavior Research Foundation has a significant breakthrough in understanding DP/DR as a special subtype of PTSD.

 

If you consider true PTSD, it is HYPER arousal -- over arousal.  DP/DR is HYPO arousal -- a "shutting down."  There is some indication that 30% of those with PTSD are in a subgroup that have DP/DR.  And PTSD is an anxiety disorder.  This gives us new insight.

https://bbrfoundatio...eople-with-ptsd


Altered Circuits May Cause ‘Out-Of-Body’ Symptoms in Some People with PTSD
May 01, 2015

Margaret McKinnon, Ph.D.

For some people with post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), symptoms go beyond the flashbacks, nightmares, sleeplessness, and tense feelings that trouble many. Up to 30 percent of people with PTSD also suffer from symptoms known as depersonalization and de-realization––that is, they experience “out-of-body” episodes or feelings that the world is not real. These disturbances to awareness and consciousness are known as dissociation.
New research now reveals that brain circuits involved in fear processing are wired differently in these people than in others diagnosed with PTSD. The findings, reported in Neuropsychopharmacology, suggest that such patients need different treatment options.



PTSD with dissociation is recognized as a distinct subtype of the disorder. It is most common among people whose PTSD developed after repeated traumas or childhood adversity. Genetic factors can also increase the risk of developing PTSD with dissociation.

Studies have found that reminders of traumatic events trigger different patterns of neural activity in patients with dissociative PTSD than they do in people who have PTSD without dissociation. In both groups, emotion-regulating brain circuits are thought to be disrupted. Emotional responses are undermodulated (under-regulated, or controlled) by the brain in most people with PTSD, causing them to relive traumatic events and experience hyperarousal symptoms such as being easily startled. In people with the dissociative subtype of PTSD, in contrast, emotional responses are overmodulated (over-regulated) by the brain, leading to emotional detachment and the subtype's characteristic feelings of depersonalization and derealization.

Senior author Ruth Lanius, M.D., Ph.D., of the University of Western Ontario led a team of scientists that included two-time (2007 and 2009) NARSAD Young Investigator grantee Margaret McKinnon, Ph.D., of McMaster University in Ontario. The scientists used functional magnetic resonance imaging to compare activity in the brains of 49 people with PTSD, 13 of whom had been diagnosed with the dissociative subtype of the disorder. Their study also included 40 people without PTSD.

The researchers focused their analysis on parts of the brain that connect to the amygdala, a small structure deep in the brain that is involved in emotion and fear processing. They examined connections to two parts of the amygdala: the basolateral amygdala, which evaluates sensory information and helps integrate emotions, and the centromedial amygdala, which helps execute fear responses.

They found that in the brains of patients with the dissociative subtype of PTSD, the amygdala was more strongly connected to brain regions involved in consciousness, awareness, emotional regulation, and proprioception (the sense of body position) than it was in PTSD patients without the dissociative subtype. The researchers say that patients' dissociative symptoms may be directly related to these alterations in the brain's functional circuitry.

 

..........

Senior author Ruth Lanius, M.D., Ph.D., of the University of Western Ontario led a team of scientists that included two-time (2007 and 2009) NARSAD Young Investigator grantee Margaret McKinnon, Ph.D., of McMaster University in Ontario.
 




#352265 [Trigger Warning] I finally found out what ACTUALLY caused my Depersonalizati...

Posted by *Dreamer* on 09 May 2015 - 01:00 PM in Discussion

It is known that certain antibiotics cause depersonalization, but it usually passes once a mentally healthy individual goes off of it.

There is an article around here about minocycline.  One side-effect is indeed DP.

A number of past members of the board have experienced DP from a tentanus shot and other antibiotics. The reason is not clear.

If you have taken rec drugs as well, it would be difficult to sort out which contributed.

Also, re: rec drug use, there are SOME individuals who suffer no ill effects when used for recreational purposes.
SOME of us are predisposed to mental illness and a rec drug can indeed TRIGGER various psychiatric problems such as HPPD, dissociation, and in some cases can trigger a first attack of psychosis, or one episode of psychosis.

In a sense ALL chemicals you ingest from caffeine to alcohol to Rx meds to OTC meds to Rec drugs are affecting your brain in some way.  Lingering affects can happen in some people for varying degrees of time.

This is a medical fact.  You have a predisposition + a stressor (such as a rec drug) and it can result in a brief or extended negative event.

Ketamine for example IS a dissociative drug.  It is used during certain surgeries where individuals are partly "knocked out" or have no memory of an event such as invasive cardiac procedures -- insertion of a stent, etc. This is well known in all specialties.  Dentists use "twilight sleep" that can cause temporary dissociation and afterwards all sorts of symptoms including DP/DR -- but not in EVERY person.




#352264 Word Salad

Posted by *Dreamer* on 09 May 2015 - 12:52 PM in The Daily Forum

When I speak out loud around other people I get scared that what I say will make no sense. Often after I say sentence out loud without thinking about it, my heart kind of drops and I have to think about what I just said to make sure it makes sense, and the people around me were able to understand it. It is like I have the tendencies of schizophrenic in this sense, but the difference is that schizophrenic's are not aware of their non sensible sentences.

 

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Word_salad

 

Anyone else get like this?

NO, you do not have any schizophrenia tendencies.  Schizophrenia is a severe, dramatic, disorder.
If people understand what you are saying there is no way you are speaking in a "word salad."

Please people do not self-diagnose, or go searching the internet for terms that have nothing to do with anxiety or DP/DR, etc.

You may feel anxious, your mnd may seem to "act slower" and you may be so self-conscious that you really can't put thoughts together.  THIS IS NOT SCHIZOPHRENIA or "word salad."




#352239 Research - PTSD - special group with DP/DR

Posted by *Dreamer* on 08 May 2015 - 04:51 PM in Discussion

This could be the true definition of "Complex PTSD" which is not an official psychiatric term.

This could be applicable to those of us with a background of long term abuse.

https://bbrfoundatio...eople-with-ptsd

 

Altered Circuits May Cause ‘Out-Of-Body’ Symptoms in Some People with PTSD
May 01, 2015

Margaret McKinnon, Ph.D.

 

For some people with post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), symptoms go beyond the flashbacks, nightmares, sleeplessness, and tense feelings that trouble many. Up to 30 percent of people with PTSD also suffer from symptoms known as depersonalization and de-realization––that is, they experience “out-of-body” episodes or feelings that the world is not real. These disturbances to awareness and consciousness are known as dissociation.

New research now reveals that brain circuits involved in fear processing are wired differently in these people than in others diagnosed with PTSD. The findings, reported in Neuropsychopharmacology, suggest that such patients need different treatment options.

PTSD with dissociation is recognized as a distinct subtype of the disorder. It is most common among people whose PTSD developed after repeated traumas or childhood adversity. Genetic factors can also increase the risk of developing PTSD with dissociation.

Studies have found that reminders of traumatic events trigger different patterns of neural activity in patients with dissociative PTSD than they do in people who have PTSD without dissociation.

 

In both groups, emotion-regulating brain circuits are thought to be disrupted. Emotional responses are undermodulated (under-regulated, or controlled) by the brain in most people with PTSD, causing them to relive traumatic events and experience hyperarousal symptoms such as being easily startled. In people with the dissociative subtype of PTSD, in contrast, emotional responses are overmodulated (over-regulated) by the brain, leading to emotional detachment and the subtype's characteristic feelings of depersonalization and derealization.

Senior author Ruth Lanius, M.D., Ph.D., of the University of Western Ontario led a team of scientists that included two-time (2007 and 2009) NARSAD Young Investigator grantee Margaret McKinnon, Ph.D., of McMaster University in Ontario. The scientists used functional magnetic resonance imaging to compare activity in the brains of 49 people with PTSD, 13 of whom had been diagnosed with the dissociative subtype of the disorder. Their study also included 40 people without PTSD.

The researchers focused their analysis on parts of the brain that connect to the amygdala, a small structure deep in the brain that is involved in emotion and fear processing. They examined connections to two parts of the amygdala: the basolateral amygdala, which evaluates sensory information and helps integrate emotions, and the centromedial amygdala, which helps execute fear responses.

They found that in the brains of patients with the dissociative subtype of PTSD, the amygdala was more strongly connected to brain regions involved in consciousness, awareness, emotional regulation, and proprioception (the sense of body position) than it was in PTSD patients without the dissociative subtype. The researchers say that patients' dissociative symptoms may be directly related to these alterations in the brain's functional circuitry.

-----------------
So again, it may be appropriate to move DP/DR related to childhood trauma to the Anxiety Disorders under
PTSD - dissociative subtype.

Makes sense to me.  More research to be done.




#352193 Awareness post made it to 100 shares!

Posted by *Dreamer* on 06 May 2015 - 09:00 PM in Depersonalization & Media

Thank you so much dude!  I've had shares from my post.
We keep getting the word out.
<3




#352151 [Trigger Warning] just gonna end it all.

Posted by *Dreamer* on 05 May 2015 - 08:57 AM in Discussion

It's difficult on any internet forum for any of us to help you directly.  If you really feel suicidal, tell someone, someone you trust, hopefully someone who loves you -- a parent, a sibling, anyone. Do you have a therapist?

Also, as someone mentioned above see an Ear, Nose and Throat doctor.  Right now I am going through some bad vertigo and it's been a week.  I can't do anything but sit up straight or lie diown.  This has happened in the past and usually passes, so far it hasn't.

 

At any rate, there are a number of treatments for this.

Check out a physical cause and treatment if that is what you need.

Also, I have noticed that when I am especially anxious my tinnitus (ringing in the ears) gets bad, and one time, I literally couldn't hear out of one ear for a day.

Also, there have been many times in my life when I have thought of suicide.  I am glad I never went through with it.  You sound very young, I am 56.  And I don't claim to be stronger than you re: this mess.  I only ask that you reach out, not here, but to any close person in your life, and literally make an appointment with an ENT.

I could kick myself at this point for having this (mainly vertigo where I can't drive my car and can barely get around) and not getting the final test where they cause you to have vertigo as there are many types.  You can also determine if you have a hearing loss, and they can also look in there and figure out a lot.

Even if I live moment to moment, it has ben worth it.  My life has taken me many places, many intersting places.  It isn't the life I wanted, but it is life.

Talk to somene close to you -- a parent even -- now.
Best,

D




#352079 Niacin for DP

Posted by *Dreamer* on 02 May 2015 - 09:58 PM in Treatment Options

I'm very sus about this as well.  And also, I just glanced at the NCBI article, but it reminded me that the degeneration that niacin seems to correct is something like Alzheimer's.  My mother had Alzhiemer's (Dx in 1987 and died in 2001 -- awful disease).

I knew that is what she probably had, but she went into the hospital for 2 weeks to clarify her diagnosis.  E.G. did she have a brain tumor that would account for her symptoms (complete memory loss, disorientation, paranoia, etc.) ... one thing they did along with a billion tests was give her Vitamin B (niacin) B3? injections.  On occasion an older person will be short on such a nutrient as they just aren't eating properly.

Well, she didn't respond as that was not the problem.

As I always say, if niacin were a cure, individuals who take this to improve their cholesterol levels would be singing in the streets.  I have to laugh as a "niacin" flush is a great way to get a man to understand "hot flashes."

Excessive doses of this can cause serious problems including stroke and death.

One anecdotal story like this ... I don't buy it.  IMHO.




#351885 Did Virginia Wolfe have DP?

Posted by *Dreamer* on 28 April 2015 - 12:16 PM in Discussion

"I felt a Funeral, in my Brain,
And Mourners to and fro
Kept treading--treading--till it seemed
That Sense was breaking through--
And when they all were seated,
A Service, like a Drum--
Kept beating--beating till I thought
My Mind was going numb--

And then I heard them lift a Box
And creak across my Soul
With those same Boots of Lead, again,
Then Space--began to toll,

As all the Heavens were a Bell,
And Being, but an Ear,
And I, and Silence, some strange Race
Wrecked, solitary here--


And then a Plank in Reason, broke--
And I dropped down, and down--
And hit a World, at every plunge,
And Finished knowing--then--"


- Emily Dickinson -
I identify with this poem very much, yet, I  believe she is describing depression.

I would say Slyvia Plath in "The Bell Jar" may have been describing DP/DR, but it is difficult to tell.  The title is telling however.  I remember when I read it as a young woman it scared the Hell out of me.  She also took her own life.




#351884 Serious Question I need answered from DP experts?

Posted by *Dreamer* on 28 April 2015 - 12:03 PM in Discussion

Zed, I read your comments a while back and simply want to state ...
1.  I NEVER said that medicine is the only way to help ANY mental illness.  I mentioned the "three legged stool" which includes therapy, lifestyle changes, and medicine if necessary.
2.  I also believe in the scientific POV as it has won over misconceptions of the past.  It was believed a cold mother caused schizoprhenia for example.  In the Middle Ages individuals with mental illness (and epilepsy for that matter) were seen as being possessed by the Devil and had exorcisms and holes drilled in their skulls to "release the demons." Thank God we moved on from those concepts.

Having been through classic psychoanalysis in the 1980s I found-- AND SO DID MY PSYCHOANALYST -- that there was nothing to "uncover" in my past.  What we worked on were psychological issues -- not my symptoms -- such as learning that my Mother and father had serious issues. Learning I wasn't worthless.  Learning I could speak my mind.  But there was no mysterious "secret" in my past keeping the DP/DR alive.

Note again, I saw two founding members of the ISSMPD, now the ISST-D.  One of them gave me Klonopin.  A psychoanalyst saw improvement in patients with DP/DR on Klonopin in 1987. The actual founding member of the ISSMPD was Cornelia Wilbur who treated Sybil (Shirley Ardell Mason) for 16 personalites.  I just finished reading "Sybil in her own words."  I see nothing to even indicate she had what would be called MPD.  She was an anxious and shy person.  She did not start developing these personalities until 6 months into treatment.  She also had a co-dependent relationship with Dr. Wilbur that was lifelong.

Shirley during all of this therapy was an artist, an art teacher, and seemed to have a rather normal life.  Her parents were nothing like the characters portrayed in the NOVEL "Sybil" -- why didn't Wilbur present a case study, instead of making millions off of a fiction book and then movie?

This is where my doubts come from.  From studying and reading BOTH sides, and having had treatment of ALL kinds.

I have been through the cycle of psychiatric treatment since 1975 when I was 16.  After all these years, the most effective therpeutic treatments were indeed CBT and DBT.  Learning how to cope with my symptoms, not be frightened by them, and finding mindfulness, exercise and diet all make a difference in making me feel better.

USE WHATEVER ROUTE YOU WANT TO GET WELL. 
Also, I have to say the link you gave is from 2012 and the forum is no longer functioning.
And again, I am a NAMI advocate.  I am currently in a Peer2Peer group based solely on CBT and DBT and group discussions to help all sorts of people with their illnesses -- bipolar, schizophrenia, severe anxiety.  We all have alot in common -- but most have loving families.  I dont' have that at all. That is an issue I deal with in therapy.

Nonone is throwing science in your face.  Take it or leave it.
I and others hear are more connected to that model, but please don't tell me I haven't been through years of therapy where psychoanalysis was the primary way to treat patients.

But also, if you're talking about anyone making money off of this -- psychoanalysis is so expensive, very few people can afford it.  Top psychoanalysts can charge $300 a session and will keep you coming back if your symptoms are not resolved. There is no set "goal."  I have found with CBT and DBT there are projects and homework that one practices daily.  I was never given that approach in psychoanalysis ... and got nowhere for years.  CBT and DBT often have a time limit.  You learn skills and apply them.  But you can continue as long as you feel you need to and/or have the money.  Again, in the US we do not have social medicine, we have private health insurance.  VERY few save the wealthy can afford psychoanalysis.

THAT IS MY EXPERIENCE.
Choose your own path.  And please don't judge what path others take.
THE END.

 




#351883 Did Virginia Wolfe have DP?

Posted by *Dreamer* on 28 April 2015 - 11:50 AM in Discussion

It has been a long time since I read V. Woolfe ... but I believe she had severe depression.  In the books I read, I did not read "DP/DR" I identified with her depression which she battled her entire life.  The same with Emily Dickinson -- a favorite poet of mine.

Woolfe did commit suicide at some point.

I suppose she could have experienced DP/DR, but it is my understanding, as with Dickinson sp? both had severe depression.




#351766 Serious Question I need answered from DP experts?

Posted by *Dreamer* on 25 April 2015 - 12:12 AM in Discussion

Interesting.  I fully admit I do not understand DDNOS, and I am very confused by DID/MPD, etc., etc..  In looking at the ICD-10, the dissociative disorders category is all over the place.  Note in the WHO International Classification, DP and DR are not even in the dissociative disorder category.  They are listed under "Other Neurotic Disorders."  As far as I'm concerned the term "neurotic" is from the past century and should be pitched.  But again, what do I know? LOL.  All I know is I undersatnd what PSYCHOTIC means.  I suppose anything neurotic is not psychotic. ???? *facepalm*
---------------------------------------------------
I can only say  from my experience.  I have had DP/DR my entire life (early it was more episodic, but got chronic after my teen years).  The DP/DR experience for me feels 100% neurological.  Major disruption of feeling my body, and how I see the world, though I know I shouldn't feel that way.  I also feel dizzy more often than not.  And I know I do not have amnesia for anything.  In my case I recall my past in great detail, and also wrote journals since I was very young.

The point is, if I diagnosis is relatively clear, yes, then one can head on the right path to treatment.  As is noted, there is less of a "clear path" to treatment of dissociative disorders.  It is a matter of what works for the individual.

I have trouble with psychiatrists/therapists who hypnotize or use hypnotic drugs to "integrate" or to "find forgotten memories."  I don't know what to make of that.  I would believe more in Freud's "free asociation" without any administration of a hypnotic or hypnosis.

Also, as science has taken decades to understand all medical problems, it doesn't make science irrelevant.  It is a a slow process.  The same is to be said about the psychoanalytic school.  If we call Freud "the father of psychoanalysis" we can also say there are so many others who broke off into factions ... away from Freud and have their own theories.

In the ICD-10, all of this is a mysetery to me.  The one disorder which seems consistent -- and I admit it is MY experience -- is the specific description of DP/DR.  That's it.  I don't fit into any other category in the dissociative disorders.  Also, nothing comes alone.  Most every brain disorder has co-morbid problems - anxiety, depression, etc., etc.

If you want sheer confusion, forget about the DSM-5 and look at the ICD-10.  Makes your head swim.  This also causes confusion on the board here, as individuals in the UK and other countries are being diagnosed often without the DSM-5, but with the ICD-9 Codes.

http://apps.who.int/.../2015/en#/F44.8

 

    F44 Dissociative [conversion] disorders  

F44.9 Dissociative [conversion] disorder, unspecified

 

 

Dissociative [conversion] disorders

The common themes that are shared by dissociative or conversion disorders are a partial or complete loss of the normal integration between memories of the past, awareness of identity and immediate sensations, and control of bodily movements. All types of dissociative disorders tend to remit after a few weeks or months, particularly if their onset is associated with a traumatic life event. More chronic disorders, particularly paralyses and anaesthesias, may develop if the onset is associated with insoluble problems or interpersonal difficulties. These disorders have previously been classified as various types of "conversion hysteria". They are presumed to be psychogenic in origin, being associated closely in time with traumatic events, insoluble and intolerable problems, or disturbed relationships. The symptoms often represent the patient's concept of how a physical illness would be manifest. Medical examination and investigation do not reveal the presence of any known physical or neurological disorder. In addition, there is evidence that the loss of function is an expression of emotional conflicts or needs. The symptoms may develop in close relationship to psychological stress, and often appear suddenly. Only disorders of physical functions normally under voluntary control and loss of sensations are included here. Disorders involving pain and other complex physical sensations mediated by the autonomic nervous system are classified under somatization disorder (F45.0). The possibility of the later appearance of serious physical or psychiatric disorders should always be kept in mind.

Incl.: conversion:
  • hysteria
  • reaction
hysteria hysterical psychosis Excl.: malingering [conscious simulation] (Z76.5)
F44.0 Dissociative amnesia

The main feature is loss of memory, usually of important recent events, that is not due to organic mental disorder, and is too great to be explained by ordinary forgetfulness or fatigue. The amnesia is usually centred on traumatic events, such as accidents or unexpected bereavements, and is usually partial and selective. Complete and generalized amnesia is rare, and is usually part of a fugue (F44.1). If this is the case, the disorder should be classified as such. The diagnosis should not be made in the presence of organic brain disorders, intoxication, or excessive fatigue.

Excl.: alcohol- or other psychoactive substance-induced amnesic disorder (F10-F19 with common fourth character .6) amnesia: nonalcoholic organic amnesic syndrome (F04) postictal amnesia in epilepsy (G40.-)
F44.1 Dissociative fugue

Dissociative fugue has all the features of dissociative amnesia, plus purposeful travel beyond the usual everyday range. Although there is amnesia for the period of the fugue, the patient's behaviour during this time may appear completely normal to independent observers.

Excl.: postictal fugue in epilepsy (G40.-)
F44.2 Dissociative stupor

Dissociative stupor is diagnosed on the basis of a profound diminution or absence of voluntary movement and normal responsiveness to external stimuli such as light, noise, and touch, but examination and investigation reveal no evidence of a physical cause. In addition, there is positive evidence of psychogenic causation in the form of recent stressful events or problems.

Excl.: organic catatonic disorder (F06.1) stupor:
F44.3 Trance and possession disorders

Disorders in which there is a temporary loss of the sense of personal identity and full awareness of the surroundings. Include here only trance states that are involuntary or unwanted, occurring outside religious or culturally accepted situations.

Excl.: states associated with:
F44.4 Dissociative motor disorders

In the commonest varieties there is loss of ability to move the whole or a part of a limb or limbs. There may be close resemblance to almost any variety of ataxia, apraxia, akinesia, aphonia, dysarthria, dyskinesia, seizures, or paralysis.

Psychogenic:
  • aphonia
  • dysphonia
F44.5 Dissociative convulsions

Dissociative convulsions may mimic epileptic seizures very closely in terms of movements, but tongue-biting, bruising due to falling, and incontinence of urine are rare, and consciousness is maintained or replaced by a state of stupor or trance.

F44.6 Dissociative anaesthesia and sensory loss

Anaesthetic areas of skin often have boundaries that make it clear that they are associated with the patient's ideas about bodily functions, rather than medical knowledge. There may be differential loss between the sensory modalities which cannot be due to a neurological lesion. Sensory loss may be accompanied by complaints of paraesthesia. Loss of vision and hearing are rarely total in dissociative disorders.

Psychogenic deafness
F44.7 Mixed dissociative [conversion] disorders Combination of disorders specified in F44.0-F44.6
F44.8 Other dissociative [conversion] disorders Ganser syndrome Multiple personality Psychogenic:
  • confusion
  • twilight state
F44.9 Dissociative [conversion] disorder, unspecified
F45

**********************************************************

In the ICD-10, DP/DR fall into a completely different category from the DSM-5 ... or it's own odd category.  This just jumbles up my head completely.  DP/DR here is considered "extremely rare."  I would say that about DID or formerly MPD.

 

F48 Other neurotic disorders
F48.0 Neurasthenia

Considerable cultural variations occur in the presentation of this disorder, and two main types occur, with substantial overlap. In one type, the main feature is a complaint of increased fatigue after mental effort, often associated with some decrease in occupational performance or coping efficiency in daily tasks. The mental fatiguability is typically described as an unpleasant intrusion of distracting associations or recollections, difficulty in concentrating, and generally inefficient thinking. In the other type, the emphasis is on feelings of bodily or physical weakness and exhaustion after only minimal effort, accompanied by a feeling of muscular aches and pains and inability to relax. In both types a variety of other unpleasant physical feelings is common, such as dizziness, tension headaches, and feelings of general instability. Worry about decreasing mental and bodily well-being, irritability, anhedonia, and varying minor degrees of both depression and anxiety are all common. Sleep is often disturbed in its initial and middle phases but hypersomnia may also be prominent.

Fatigue syndrome Use additional code, if desired, to identify previous physical illness. Excl.: asthenia NOS (R53) burn-out (Z73.0) malaise and fatigue (R53) postviral fatigue syndrome (G93.3) psychasthenia (F48.8)
F48.1 Depersonalization-derealization syndrome

A rare disorder in which the patient complains spontaneously that his or her mental activity, body, and surroundings are changed in their quality, so as to be unreal, remote, or automatized. Among the varied phenomena of the syndrome, patients complain most frequently of loss of emotions and feelings of estrangement or detachment from their thinking, their body, or the real world. In spite of the dramatic nature of the experience, the patient is aware of the unreality of the change. The sensorium is normal and the capacity for emotional expression intact. Depersonalization-derealization symptoms may occur as part of a diagnosable schizophrenic, depressive, phobic, or obsessive-compulsive disorder. In such cases the diagnosis should be that of the main disorder.

F48.8 Other specified neurotic disorders Dhat syndrome Occupational neurosis, including writer cramp Psychasthenia Psychasthenic neurosis Psychogenic syncope
F48.9 Neurotic disorder, unspecified Neurosis NOS
         

-------------------------------------------

all any of this what you will, in my experience, I have specifically the experience of DP and DR, anxiety, and depression, and have had these my entire life.  Why?  I really don't know.  I had a very dysfunctional family, but I know of others who had worse, and many who had loving families yet have the same symptoms I do.C

The key again -- figure out what is going on as best a s possible.  Deal with what is going on in a holistic manner -- therapy, lifestyle changes, mindfulness, medication if so desired or needed, socializing ... basically trying to live with the highest quality of life.




#351743 Serious Question I need answered from DP experts?

Posted by *Dreamer* on 23 April 2015 - 08:32 PM in Discussion

 

 

Anxiety is NOT the cause of dissociative disorders. Anxiety is a common symptom of DD's, as well as OCD, depression, social isolation, self esteem issues etc. I've read many times here people being told by their doctors or counsellors "DPD is a symptom of anxiety" or "or DPD is just anxiety", but this is not true. It's NOT JUST anxiety. Anxiety is different to the dissociative disorders. Once you begin working on and taking away the dissociative 'disorder', the symptoms fade also. It's no good treating just the symptoms b/c the dissociation will always be present, and THAT'S what's causing the problems/symptoms in the first place

I don't think we can say what causes dissociative disorders.  It is a combinatioin of many things, just as are all illnesses, physical and mental.

And again, Dissociative Disorders is a very specific category whether the category is correct or incorrect at this point.
Dissociative Disorders are:
1.  Depersonalization/Derealization Disorder
2.  Dissociative Amnesia and Fugue State
3.  Dissociative Identity Disorder
4.  Dissociative DIsorder Not Otherwise Specified

Each are a different type of perceptual disotortion of self.  DPD stands alone in having no amnesia.

Anxiety Disorders are a separate category
and for example OCD is an anxiety disorder as is PTSD, GAD, Social Anxiety.

And no one truly understands the Dissociative Disorders in particular.  One thing that is agreed upon is that when someone has a panic attack (and that could be associated with any number of diagnoses) a SECONDARY or resulting symptom of a panic attack is DP/DR.  This is specifically noted in the DSM-5 and is more commonly known.

However, in the DSM-5, DPD has been recognized as a disorder unto itself.  And the causes are SPECULATED about.

---------------------------------------------

As has been noted so many times, no one here is an expert, and experts in the field to not agree on what they see causing DP/DR symptoms although, yes, there seems to be a connection with verbal (not physical abuse), rec drugs, some Rx drugs, and other brain truamas.

Generally doctors are of one of two schools of thought -- psychoanalytic, or more medical.  One focus' more on Nurture/Environment, the other on Nature/Predisposition, etc.

There is no simple answer really as to the "why" and exact treatment of any mental illness specifically.  We know that if we use a holistic approach ... therapy, lifestyle, and meds (the basic "three legs of the stool") ... we can come closest to a higher quality of life and what I call remission.  I was just at a meeting where we discussed that for most of us mental illness is a life long issue, but that doesn't mean there can't be a great quality of life.

As usual, we are unique.  We are only experts on our own situation, which is unique to each and every one of us.

Also, in a sense things do "come out of the blue."  That is an apparently normal child can develop autism at 14 months.  Someone can develop schizophrenia anywhere from birth to around age 30.  After that it is rare for it to come on.  But one could say, "How did that happen?"  But one could say that about a child with a birth defect, an adult who gets lung cancer, etc.

There are MANY explanations, and MANY ways to go about treatment. And treatment is limited to the research we have so far. We have a long way to go.

I suppose others have said the same thing.

But I also think it is unfair to state that those who choose "X" way of looking at their illness are "keeping themselves sick."  Saying that, and seemingly stating that as fact, serves no purpose and helps no one.  We should look at what is common in our experiences, learn from those things, and learn from how we have coped.




#351597 dissociative identity disorder and DP

Posted by *Dreamer* on 19 April 2015 - 07:33 PM in Discussion

Zed, it is unlikely you and I will ever come to an agreement on anything!  However, I can state that one of the cases mentioned in the article, "The West Memphis Three" accused of killing 3 boys was overturned 18 years after those men had been in jail.  There have been several documentaries on it, news articles, legal arguments, etc.

Jumping to "Satanic Ritual Abuse" as a cause for criminal behavior is a more complex conspiratorial view of most crimes.

The Memphis Three were pardoned (in a complex deal) in 2011.  It was a special plea deal due to mishandling of the case, and discovery of DNA from another individual responsible for the crime.

The famous cases I noted that occurred in the 1980s and 1990s ... all were found to be false.  Unfortunately some individuals are still imprisoned for things they could not possibly have done ... such as rape children in space ships.  If you read anything about the McMartin PreSchool Case, and The Little Rascals Day Care Case, you will see a pattern of miscarriage of justice.

Many of the same names come up.  Colin Ross, M.D. is one, who is seen as a charlatan.  He has been sued as was Bennet Braun.  Certain psychoanalysts insist in MPD to this day.  Most other doctors do not believe it exists (in multiples or satanic abuse).  You may choose to believe what you wish. I have no control over that.

I won't argue this.  I can imagine there could be criminals who believe they are motivated by the Devil (psychotic individuals for example), but most of these cases have been disproved.

Also, re: accusations against parents have destroyed families when accusations were made that were later recanted.

Sure, people do hideous things to their children, but the concept of Satanic Ritual Abuse as it played out in those years proved to be false as did the creation of multiple alter personalities in individuals.  You would have to go on a case by case basis.  These cases are often very difficult to prove and don't hold up in court, and are overturned even decades later.

We see this from a different POV, so we agree to disagree.

 




#351413 dissociative identity disorder and DP

Posted by *Dreamer* on 14 April 2015 - 11:45 AM in Discussion

The Structured Clinical Interview for DSM-IV Axis I Disorders (SCID-I) is a diagnostic exam used to determine DSM-IV Axis I disorders (major mental disorders). The SCID-II is a diagnostic exam used to determine Axis II disorders (personality disorders). There are at least 700 published studies in which the SCID was the diagnostic instrument used. Major parts of the SCID have been translated into other languages, including Danish, French, German, Greek, Hebrew, Italian, Portuguese, Spanish, Swedish, Turkish, and Zulu.

An Axis I SCID assessment with a psychiatric patient usually takes between 1 and 2 hours, depending on the complexity of the subject's psychiatric history and their ability to clearly describe episodes of current and past symptoms. A SCID with a non-psychiatric patient takes 1/2 hour to 1-1/2 hours. (See editions below.) A SCID-II personality assessment takes about 1/2 to 1 hour.

The instrument was designed to be administered by a mental health professional, for example a psychologist or psychiatrist. This must be someone who has relevant professional training and has had experience performing unstructured, open-ended question, diagnostic evaluations. However, for the purposes of some research studies, non-clinician research assistants, who have extensive experience with the study population in question, and who have demonstrated competence, have been trained to use the SCID. The less clinical experience and specific education the potential interviewer has had, the more training is required.