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Member Since 20 Jun 2014
Offline Last Active Jul 24 2014 08:51 AM

#339212 Recovered - Read & Be Amazed

Posted by jonobe on 24 July 2014 - 03:38 AM

A lot of people write 'hey, get off this site to get better.'


This advice is written by people who've all been here and now recovered.  


In the good old days (before internet)  there wasn't anything like this site.  And if you feel 'on your own' now, imagine if you didn't even know there were others who had this thing. 


This site is a very valuable place.  I get that some people need to get off it and get on with their lives.   If being on this site is preventing you from getting 'out there', then obviously that's not a good thing.  But the site can also be a great support.  Before the internet, you would have been really on your own.  You can get on with your life and still come to this site, that's for sure.




Seeing many different stories here, I'm beginning to see people are different, have different symptoms, have different needs and are at different places in their recovery.  I'm beginning to think that the 'everybody listen to my advice,' is actually one of the (final) stages of dpdr, it is so very common.  (oh, yes, I've been through the stage!)


It is as if you have become an angel, and out of the goodness of your heart, you descend back to hell and see the poor devils crying for help.  You declare 'I will save you, brother, sister!  Let's get you out of this place!  Follow me!'  


But could it be (I know you won't agree), but could it be it's not really the others you are trying to save.  


It is yourself.



#338046 DP/DR never stopped anyone climbing a mountain.

Posted by jonobe on 11 July 2014 - 02:54 AM

Go climb a mountain.


Take a photo when you're up there.



#337975 ya know?

Posted by jonobe on 10 July 2014 - 02:50 AM

'Life shouldnt be so complicated, we should be able to live and love naturally...'


what a beautiful thought.  That tells me you don't just see the negative, you're not cold.  You're someone you should be proud of.  



'why did we have to let other peoples bad side consume us???'


You don't have to.


Best wishes.

#337919 Repersonalisation/Rerealisation: a Recovery Guide to dp/dr.

Posted by jonobe on 09 July 2014 - 12:31 PM

@jonobe , im still not sure wether i have dp/dr  , but my vision, is exactly like, when u get high from weed, and your perspective of things changes, everything kind of looks like they have more depth to them, if u have smoked weed, u will understand, 


also, i have become very sensitive to lights, and some colours, are more saturated to me (especially red). i get halos from some lights and starbursts from car headlights.

and, i kind of have a cross eyed type vision if i stare at things for a long time.


along with a whole lot of other bodily symptoms and of course anxiety.


do u think these are symptoms of DP/DR ? 

ill try out your exercise anyway though. thanks 


also, i forgot to mention, i overdosed on some very potent weed, and from then on, these symptoms have started showing.

please reply if u have any answers


some of your symptoms sound like dp/dr.  The halos and starbursts MAY be from over staring - your eyes can literally dry up from staring and this creates the patterns.  


It is also possibly unrelated, so you should see an optician to check for keratoconus or other problem.  'Anxiety' is also commonly known to create these effects: the above link from Dr B may be helpful (I haven't had a chance to see it yet).


Practise this exercise - there is a later exercise that you should find very useful and will help regarding your 'potent weed' starting point.  But you need to be familiar with the earlier exercises first.



Thank you for your comment.  I hope this helps.

#337851 Repersonalisation/Rerealisation: a Recovery Guide to dp/dr.

Posted by jonobe on 08 July 2014 - 01:46 PM

Exercise 1: Coming out of the Background

Aim: this exercise is for those who find their visual world is disturbed. If you experience, 'surreal', '2D', 'unreal' 'behind a glass' type vision, this is an important exercise.

To think about first:

Normal healthy vision has two 'modes' of viewing the world. These can be described as 'background' and 'focus' modes. It allows you to focus on one thing while ignoring everything else around it. These modes channel information and meaning in very different ways to your brain.

Look at an object in front of you. Notice things about it. Describe in words (can be internally) what you notice,(eg 'it's green/brown/red, it is shiny, it is smooth/jagged...) Stay focused on this object alone while you do this. Extend your 'noticing' to the history of the object (who, where, why) and it's purpose - even imagine a future for it.

Notice that while you are focused on this object, all other objects are just 'background', 'unimportant', 'just a part of everything else'.

Now find another object and repeat this, again verbalising what you notice. Just like before, think about it's shape, colour, purpose, texture, and other visual attributes. Then consider its history (how old is it, what's happened, what will happen).

Notice that during this, the FIRST object is now way off in the background and no longer focused on, that it now has become 'background,' 'unimportant', 'just a part of everything else.'

Continue this until there are four objects in the room you have focused on in some detail. Compare them (are they similar/different, etc). Notice if they seem more 'real'/'3D'/'stand out more' than other objects in the room now.

How has this affected your sense of visual reality?

Do this exercise regularly, in same and different places at different times, for a week.

Why? (for those of you who are interested in the 'psychology' behind the exercise)

If you have done this exercise, you will have started to notice that things can be viewed as 'in the background' or as an object of 'focus.'

The 'focus' is where interest,meaning and contact with reality is. The typical background lacks interest, is not paid attention to, secondary, lacks purpose, not important, is not contacted with any direct sense.

You may notice that the descriptions of typical 'background' are similar to descriptions of general symptoms of DP/DR. In fact, DP/DR perception is operating as if EVERYTHING including any focused object belongs to the background mode. This needs to be addressed.

Your DP/DR visual experience is operating as if the focused things you look at are in the background. Your background/focus switch is not kicking in properly (there are emotional reasons for this you can look at in later exercise). So when you look at an object of focus, it appears just another part of the uninteresting, flat, not alive, background. You need to prompt your brain out of this and return it to its proper switching between modes.

This exercise will prompt your brain to start using the 'switch' again. Just like learning to walk again. This can be extremely tiring at first. It gets easier and easier. After a while, it becomes second nature and your brain will naturally start separating the two modes again. You are aiming to reach a point where you no longer see things as 'flat'.

#337850 Repersonalisation/Rerealisation: a Recovery Guide to dp/dr.

Posted by jonobe on 08 July 2014 - 01:42 PM

There are many threads on this site that will help and encourage you to make a good recovery. Some of them are really good and offer sound advice and the writers get my respect. I don't claim this thread to be any better. But I think I can claim it is different.  Perhaps not - I haven't read every thread.

The difference is because the advice given in many of the posts relate to your attitude, the way you see the world, your approach to others, and suggest you should 'be positive' , 'learn to accept', 'don't think too much,' for example. Fair enough, it's good stuff for anyone, let alone a DP/DR sufferer.

But let's be honest: if you went to a doctor with a broken leg and he looked you up and down, prodded you about a bit, then declared, 'ah, yes, what you need to do is to 'accept yourself' or 'let your past go,' or 'learn to face reality', or the worst: 'pull yourself together!'  ..!

Well, would you accept that? Would that really help you?  You've got a broken leg, you're in terrible pain, can hardly function, and the doctor is trying to tell you to look at life differently! Would you take him seriously for a second? What would happen to that doctor? Well, I hope such a doctor would be struck off and forbidden from practising again.

So why do we talk about DP/DR with less seriousness than a broken leg? It's just as serious, and it is just as real. The fact that the medical establishment has not put enough research in to finding a medical answer does not mean it is any less serious than a broken leg. Just because others can't see it or understand it or even imagine it, doesn't mean it is any less important than any other disease or injury . I believe it is more serious than most. I hope you can agree with this. There's nothing wrong with you 'as a person'. You don't have to 'change' who you are. You need to heal.

I'm not going to waste your time. I believe you, as a dp/dr sufferer deserve better than that. You have an awful affliction that one day will be properly recognised rather than pigeon-holed as 'anxiety' or some other vague term. Let's face it, you're battling mostly on your own with practically no useful help at all. The fact that you're reading this means you are trying to get yourself better from this thing. And you're not even a doctor (probably!) . You deserve anyone's respect and you deserve the best because of the difficulties you face. I really believe that.

I'm going to describe to you some 'cognitive exercises' – some 'brain training' if you like, which I believe will give you a fighting chance against this awful disease. Just like recovering from a broken limb will require physio-therapy, these exercises are equivalent to that.

The aim of doing these is to considerably speed up your recovery and help you to help yourself by beginning to understand what's going on and doing something about it.

They are not about changing your attitude and such like. They are real 'brain' exercises that you can work with in a solid concrete way. And they leave your personality, belief and way of life alone – that's your own business. Not mine.

They will not directly help you with your difficulties you have in your life other than DP/DR. Of course, by getting rid of DP/DR you will be able to function better and deal with other problems more easily.

Be gentle on yourself. If it was a broken leg you were recovering from, you wouldn't start running as soon as you put your feet on the ground. You know what I'm saying.

If you are going to try these series of 6 cognitive exercises then do them seriously. Half-hearted will get nothing – you will just waste your own time. I welcome feedback. Feedback is also useful for others to read. Please, don't bother feedback if you aren't interested in actually trying the exercises, but just want to air your opinion about.

[One final thing. The only condition. If you are doing marijuana or similar then DON'T while you're following these exercises. Seriously. Tell your mates you're going to 'de-tox your brain' for a while and put away the weed. If you can't give up the weed for a few weeks, then don't start the exercises yet. Wait for a better time.]

Good luck.                                 (exercise 1 in comment below)

#337704 Help Please!!!

Posted by jonobe on 06 July 2014 - 11:53 AM

Hi twelvetoys.


I've read your thread and I just want to run a couple of things by you.


You've mentioned you're emotionally numb/can't feel pleasure. Have you noticed that you also write 'I also feel my dp is worse than most'?, 'my wretched DP'  'I desperately need help.'


Can you see that all these are expressions of raw emotion?  Really strong raw emotion?  Have a re-read at what you're saying. You've got a whole ocean of emotion going on.  


I would suggest:  can you acknowledge these 'wretched' feelings you're having?  Don't shut them down.  Feel them.  They are your true feelings at the moment.


You may be trying to block off unpleasant emotions (memory, something/someone), and as a 'side-effect' shutting down your pleasurable emotions.  


Sometimes before the clean water can come out of the hose, you've got to get the big crappy sods out first.


I hope this gives you something useful to think about.


I wish you well.

#337511 A cartoon view of my experience.

Posted by jonobe on 03 July 2014 - 07:08 AM

My reflection is more real than me!


#336443 completely and permanently recovered after ten long years

Posted by jonobe on 20 June 2014 - 03:32 PM

I agree with the critics of this post.  I tried all that 'just pull yourself together' bullshit.  Yes, it IS good to get on with your life.  I did, and I have had a lot of success in my life.  It didn't make the DP go away.  

What did eventually make the DP go away was a lot of therapeutic work I put myself through.  I had a degree in psychology and that didn't help - eventually I did find a psychology book that did free me, but it took a lot of work and dealing with pain in my life and re-integrating parts of my self that I had become alienated from.     (Part One, Gestalt Therapy, excitement and growth in personality by Perls, Hefferline)

I have in common with many recoverers this:  there is no 'magic' way of getting better, no line you can tell yourself to pull yourself out of the glass cage.  But you can get out of it.  You will.  Get to know yourself.  Remember, if you think you have no feelings: you do have feelings.  Emptiness and despair are feelings.  Very strong feelings. Take your time.  And get on with your life in the meantime.