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The Buddhist LIE


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#1 Abraxas

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 06:48 PM

"Buddhism is most famous today for everything it originally never taught"
Dr. A. K. Coomaraswamy


I thought I was the only DP sufferer who was fooled by Buddhism. When I started having DP symptoms, it was clear to me that they were the result of a combination of Psychedelic drugs (mainly bad trips, and mainly experiences with Salvia Divinorum, LSD, and 2CI), and Eastern Religion. Non-ego religion. Self is BAD! Nirvana is true peace, and Nirvana is extinguishing of Self. So evertime I had feelings, every time i wanted to BE, there came good ol Buddha, whispering to my ears: that is Dukkha, that is suffering,. You will get lost in a cycle of reincarnations, forever. Let go of Self, embrace Anatta, not-self. Embrace the void. Well, F**K the VOID!

But at the time, i really trusted Buddha. Everything I read of him was so noble, so truthful, so logical too. It made sense. The four noble truths make sense. The noble eightfold path makes sense. But the three marks of existence..

Annica (impermanence) makes sense. Everything is in flux. Attachment to things might cause suffering. true.

Dukkha (un-ease, not-perfect) people take Dukkha to mean suffering. It is not. Sukkha is related to how a wheel from a cart rolls, when it rolls smoothly, its called Sukka, Easiness. Dukkha is the opposite. It just means, un-ease, not-perfect. ok, I can deal with imperfection, as attachment to impermanent things might stir the mind and cause anxiety, even at low, imperceptible levels.

But... Anatta. No-Self. And here is the big big LIE hidden behind modern Buddhism. Why?
If you look at the Suttras, and specially the Ancient ones (forget about crazy Mahayana 'Greater Vehicle', Trantric, Diamond, etc... even Therevada does not reflect Buddhas true original Teachings), you will find the word Anatta, mentioned several times. ALL OF WHICH ARE USED AS AN ADJECTIVE, NOT A NOUN. Buddha says that the 5-khandas are NOT-SELF, that is to say, that Body is Anatta, not Self, that mental formations are Anatta, not Self, etc. But in reference to what???? to Self. He is saying, THIS IS NOT YOU, THIS IS NOT SELF! The correct translation of Anatta is not NO-Self, it is not-Self, and it is used as an adjective to point out all those things that SELF is not, in a classical Vedic neti neti approach to God, to Self (Atman). Mystics approach God by denying those things that He is not! Modern Buddhism will have us beleive that everything in the Universe is causal and impersonal, and that in the end everything is empty, there is no-thing, and Nirvana is some kind of anihilationist, nihilist, pathetic goal for the depressive and suicidal. Modern Buddhism is no more than spiritual suicidal.. and the PERFECT OPIUM for people suffering DP. Oh look, i am on my way to Enlightenment! this is what monks train to achieve during lifetime of meditative practice. NO. YOU ARE ILL. YOU ARE SUFFERING. THIS IS NOT SOMETHING GOOD. and if monks really try to reach a DP state, then they must be f**king stupid to say the least. And excuse me for my tone, but i can not help getting angry when talking about this, as i have suffered first-hand the impact of Modern Buddhism.

So, what did the Historical Buddha say, as expounded in the earliest suttras, about Self/Soul?
Buddha, among many things, stated:

Atta’sarana anan’n’asarana.--"Soul as a refuge with none other as refuge” DN 2.100
“Atta’ ca me so saranam gati ca” --“The Soul is the refuge that I have gone unto”
Jatakapali 1441 Akkhakandam
"Soul the refuge (Saran.am.attano)"-- DN 2.120
Jataka-2 #1341 “tattha atta’ va sarathi” ----“the Soul is Charioteer”

The Soul is also reffered as "Most dear, the Light, the only refuge" [DN 2.100, AN 4.97]

The only place in Suttra where the word NO-SOUL (Natthatta)is used, is in reference to Annihilationists/nihilists, which Buddha himself called them heretics, and had this to say:

"Those who deny the Soul (the nihilists/annihilationists) go to terrible hell, from darkness to darkness"[SN 1.96].

There is NEVER a NON-SOUL Doctrine, but a not-soul doctrine which points out those things Soul IS NOT!

I invite anyone WHO HAS BEEN ENTANGLED BY MODERN BUDDHISM to read the following articles. THOSE WHO KNOW NOTHING ABOUT BUDDHISM, DO NOT READ THIS, AS THIS WILL ADD POTENTIALLY HARMFUL INFORMATION THAT WILL ONLY HINDER YOUR RECOVERY. To those who read this articles, PLEASE, DO NOT GO ON TO READ ABOUT THIS SCHOLARS WORLD-VIEW, say NEOPLATONISM/EMANATIONISM, AS THIS WILL ONLY SUBSTITUTE YOUR DETRIMENTAL BUDDHIST BELIEF SYSTEM FOR ANOTHER EVEN MORE COMPLEX AND IMPOSSIBLE TO GRASP. READ ONLY TO DEFUSE/DEBUNK YOUR BUDDHIST BELIEFS WHICH ARE MAINTAINING YOU DERPERSONALIZATION. ONCE YOU ARE CONVINCED MODERN BUDDHISM IS INCORRECT, PLEASE STOP READING, AS IT HAS SERVED THE PURPOSE OF THIS POST. I AM TELLING YOU THIS OUT OF EXPERIENCE, I HAD ALSO TO STRUGGLE AGAINST EMANATIONIST VIEWS AFTER GETTING RID OF THE BUDDHIST PARASITE (WHICH IN ANY CASE IS MUCH WORSE, BUT STILL, ALL BELIEF SYSTEMS WHILE ON DP ARE PARASITES).

Where Buddhism Failed Miserably
Or, the story of a successful failure
http://aryan-buddhis...-miserably.html

The Palpable fear of the Soul by Modern Buddhism
http://aryan-buddhis...-by-modern.html

NOTHINGISM (Natthika)
as Heresy in Buddhist Doctrine
http://aryan-buddhis...-heresy-in.html

WHAT THE SOUL-HATING "BUDDHISTS" DONT WANT YOU TO KNOW
http://aryan-buddhis...-dont-want.html


AGAIN, DO NOT, please, DO NOT READ ANY OTHER ARTICLE THAN THESE. If you would like to discuss this, email me, and i will do my best to guide you out of this mess.

May all beings find refuge in Self.

Love,

Abraxas

#2 Felicity

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 01:45 AM

Buddhism is true in a fundamental sense, but it is not the way to happiness if that is your goal..

I think a better way to live life is just to accept what happens. If that includes your frustration and anger at Buddhism, then so be it, be angry, be pissed off, same with DP, get upset by it, get angry, really vent your disappointment because even an illusion can feel like reality.. that loss, though objectively untrue, is true in the sense that you are hurt by it. Denying your sense of grief is the worst thing you could do in my opinion. It means you'll never really get over it, because the mind works by processing whatever occurs in your life, NOT by avoiding or distracting yourself from it.

And maybe you know yourself better than any philosophy, any religion, maybe Buddhism and every other theory generated by someone else is in effect a dead end, and the answers, if there are any, must come from your own experiences and beliefs.

I think the mind we've been given is a gift, and the ego, the lower self, a useful vehicle. Rejecting it in favor of the absolute truth is actually exposing yourself to a reality which evolution, or God, whatever you believe, never intended for you to see. It's akin to pouring hot water on your hands just to understand in a visceral way that the water won't kill you.. only burn like hell.

Just my idle thoughts.

#3 Visual

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 07:31 AM

I think the mind we've been given is a gift, and the ego, the lower self, a useful vehicle. Rejecting it in favor of the absolute truth is actually exposing yourself to a reality which evolution, or God, whatever you believe, never intended for you to see. It's akin to pouring hot water on your hands just to understand in a visceral way that the water won't kill you.. only burn like hell.

Interesting observation (idle thoughts). It makes me think about different ‘realities’. Most of us are squeamish to see what a surgeon does – but our inside anatomy is part of truth – it is just something we are rarely involved with. Each of us has our own world/reality. And it takes effort and learning to interface/harmonize with other peoples’ feelings/perspectives/views.

People can get hung up about existence, free will, predestination, quantum randomness… and get stuck about it instead of living the gift of life. Of course for some their thinking has been knocked into this pattern from drug experience, trauma or whatever – so the trap gets tripped. And we must learn how to free ourselves from it. If the moment is painful or void, try to fill it with something positive (activity, friends, … even bunnies).

If reality is as Kermit below – so be it. Absolute reality is in the realm of God. We can only continue to learn - it is a journey.

If we don’t enjoy life and the moment, it is a terrible loss. For “tomorrow is promised to no one”, Clint Eastwood

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#4 Abraxas

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 11:09 AM

Hi Felicity and Visual Dude, thanks for sharing your thoughts, I really enjoyed reading your posts.

To be honest I dont think that the teachings expounded by Buddhism are fundamentally true. At least not what modern Buddhism teaches in place of the historical Buddha's word. Buddha did not write any scriptures. He did not also talk about metaphysics. He just said: there is suffering, and suffering is dealt with by following this path. His approach was practical, and did not want to go into the details of metaphysics. However, the few words and references he makes about metaphysics are very similar to Ancient Vedic Tradition, and very similar to the later Advaita Vedanta interpretation of Vedic texts, which by no means talk of No-Self (Anatta as modern Buddhist today claim). He talks of a Self (Atman) or Soul above all, in which one finds refuge and is gone unto in Nirvana. He says ,the citta (mind), gathers itself in the Light, in that which is True, in The Self, and ends the cycle of suffering, for it has found the source of its Light, the Self, the unmoved mover, the axis mundus, the center of the wheel.

Regardless of what Buddhist philosophy is or is supposed to mean, i believe that one has to have Self before one lets go of Self. People with DP have not made a conscious choice of giving away they're person (though i believe Self not to be equal to Person, but nevertheless), it has been taken away, robbed as it may. There is no free will in that, there is no conscious desicion, and that causes a lot of pain, which is real regardless of what is Absolutely real, as Felicity says. Its like being poor because they stole everything you had, or being poor because you made a conscious choice of living a humble life. That difference in Intention is all that matters. It was definitely not my intention to lose myself when i got DP, and it is still not my intention to let go of Self now, as i believe Self to be inmortal and as Absolute as anything else in Gods Mind. But that is my worldview (which is also not Buddist, as I believe in both Self and The One/Monad/God, Self having the choice of being independent of One or going back to One) and by no means it is True, it is just the result of personal experience, which as Buddha himself said, it is the only source of Wisdom. Only true wisdom gained by Experience can liberate one from suffering. Wisdom of what is real and what is not, and dealing away with what is not ,and treasuring that which is. When truth is hurled at lie, lie crumbles down and truth prevails. I genuinely believe all persons here suffering from DP will find their way out of this Desert, and into the light of Self. Time is an ilusion, truth is found at ones own pace, through acceptance of what is not, either in this life or next. I still believe though that the fastest you commit yourself to finding truth the faster you end suffering.

Good one with the kermit joke :D

Peace
Abraxas

#5 Pablo

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 12:37 PM

There are problems with translation with some words especially Dukkha which when translated as suffering is perhaps a too negative translation, but the whole concept of no-self or not-self is difficult to fully grasp even for experienced Buddhists and the falling onto the side of nihilism where you feel you don't exist at all is one of the pitfalls good teachers can steer you away from, but if you read just bits from books and internet sites I see how easy it is to fall in that pit of nihilism. But Buddhism is called the middle way for a reason and nihilism is an extreme so it is not the middle way therefore it is not Buddhism.

I'm not sure how to equate a soul with the key concept of dependent origination which helps to define Buddhism as different from Hinduism, so im not sure im qualified to really argue this point at the moment. Right now i'm working more with the approach which regards to self as being yang to the yin non self, so being and non being are two sides of the same coin both equally important in the yin and yang balance, which then if you transcend leaves you with "no view" or "beginners mind".

#6 Pablo

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 12:47 PM

double post

#7 gill

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 01:09 PM

nm

#8 PhuckDP

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 04:57 PM

Umm, here's the thing. Depersonalization that DP sufferers experience is in no way similar to the type of depersonalizaton that Buddhists advocate. Basically, the reason why DP suffers have DP is usually because their fight or flight response is constantly turned on. It wears the brain down, doesn't allow it to work at it's full capacity. I mean, with DP there's so much mess in our brain, we eventually give in and and start to dissociate.
Whereas on the other hand, Buddhism depersonalization is something completely different. It's a state of complete bliss, oneness with the universe and all that surrounds you, living in the moment and so on. In Buddhism depersonalization, everything's clear to you, world opens up, everything makes sense, it's a path towards enlightment. Whereas when one suffers from the DP disorder, he's not himself but in a bad way. The mind of that person is so clogged and that person lacks empathy, feelings and with that emotional intelligence, social intelligence etc. That person can barely function. So it's a lot different. DP sufferers have a much lower capacity of thinking and functioning than their normal selves. Whereas Buddhism depersonalization enhances the person, really, intellectually, spiritually, emotionally...all around. So yeah, it is a great state to be in. DP as a disorder is hell though and it makes people shell of their normal selves, just a lot less capable than they normally are. So the two depersonalizations are actually completely opposite.

#9 Abraxas

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 09:31 PM

spot on. DP is spiritual rock bottom. No way around it. I find it mind-boggling that there are people making claims about DP being enlightenment, even in this forum. They either dont know DP, or they are just in a sort of twisted denial. DP is suffering. Enlightenment is pure bliss, absolute freedom, absolute Knowing. DP is a state of fear, of confusion, of great pain. Having gone through it and out, I assure you it is more like Hell, and far, very far from an Enlightened state.

Peace
Abraxas

#10 sunyata samsara

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 04:29 AM

Wow so you are bashing Buddhism because at first you misunderstood it and now understand it better yet still misunderstand or the fact that modern Buddhists as you call it dont understand Buddhism as it is suppose to be. What about me im a Buddhist and i understand it. If you want to bash Buddhism bring it, i will correct your false views on it. Buddhism is confusing it has many different techniques that are meant for people on different levels on the path. I made the mistake a decade ago of rejecting emotion which is a lower Buddhist method that is suppose to be for people who cant do that because they dont have that much control of their mind, looks like you did the same lulz. I ended up being emotionless because i became to good at it and normally i remain emotionless but now i can actually surge emotion where its like a surge of bliss, its like the opposite of crying yet i normally remain emotionless so as not to be affected by the outside world or the conditioned self.

#11 sunyata samsara

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 04:54 AM

"Gotama was a miserable failure." that site is biased and wrongly interprets Buddhism. They spell his name wrong for fucks sake, its Gautama.

Now a quote from you "DO NOT, please, DO NOT READ ANY OTHER ARTICLE THAN THESE." why because they bash Buddhism and have an incorrect view of Buddhism.

On that site it basically said Advaita is right Buddhism is wrong, Buddhism is Advaita. Read the book Advaita In Indian Philosophy. He understands Buddhism and describes how Sunyavada Buddhism, Yogacara Buddhism, Advaita Vedanta and Kashmir Shaivism are the same only explained differently.

#12 Abraxas

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 09:14 AM

"Gotama was a miserable failure." that site is biased and wrongly interprets Buddhism. They spell his name wrong for fucks sake, its Gautama.

Now a quote from you "DO NOT, please, DO NOT READ ANY OTHER ARTICLE THAN THESE." why because they bash Buddhism and have an incorrect view of Buddhism.

On that site it basically said Advaita is right Buddhism is wrong, Buddhism is Advaita. Read the book Advaita In Indian Philosophy. He understands Buddhism and describes how Sunyavada Buddhism, Yogacara Buddhism, Advaita Vedanta and Kashmir Shaivism are the same only explained differently.


Brother I do not wish to go into a philosophical/metaphysical discussion with you. I have my own wisdom gained by experience and my world-view is probably very different than yours, still i feel no need to impose my views on anyone. You seem to be yourself in spiritual doubt, as you come here and so angrily defend your belief system. Where is the emotionlesness you speak about?

About Buddhism. What the scholar who wrote those articles suggests, is not that Buddhism is wrong, but that Modern Buddhism is NOT what the Buddha taught. He suscribes to Ancient, Aryan Buddhism. Furthermore, he says Buddhism is not different to Vedic philosophy, that Buddha in fact said that he had 'rediscovered an ancient path', that is the Vedic path. we are both saying the same thing bro, that modern buddhism today is not what Buddha really taught. In my thread I write 'Buddhist' lie, because Buddhism is the name by which 'modern Buddhism' goes. And Aryan Buddhism is really not known. If the thread was addressed to you, I would have added the word modern. But this thread is clearly not for you, who have apparently advanced knowledge of what buddhism is or isnt.

Also, why do you think Buddha didnt write any scriptures, and encouraged oral transmission from Master to Disciple? Because he knew people would misinterpret such delicate information. Information is not knowledge, knowledge is not Wisdom. Only wisdom gets you to liberation. All i am trying to do here is try and help out people who have stumbled upon this subtle information and, given to their condition (DP), has proven detrimental to their spiritual growth. If you do not agree with this intention, then you are quite frankly a retard. People here do not need Buddhism. They need to be themselves again. Then, when healthy and out of free will, they can choose to suscribe to any religion, if they will. If you think DP is the perfect chance to get closer to Nirvana by extinguishing whats left of self, keep that 'advice' to yourself as it is quite SICK in my humble opinion.

All I was tryig to do here is inform people who are a bit lost on the so called Anatta doctrine which is simply non-existent and if you are really in the know as you claim to be you should nothing more than agree.

Brother, if your really do not want to not be 'tainted by the conditioning self and world', then why are you here in a forum, arguing with so much zest, even worse, taking pride in your 'knowledge' and taking an attitude of dis-respect for the 'ignorant'.

But well, may I also say, i personally believe you do not understand the mind of God, and while your annihilationist view on Self is acceptable (and I am sure you will reach Nirvana that way), your going back to the Monad is for me the way of cowards. Much more willpower is required to forge Self and approach the Unmoved Mover with complete free will and individuality. Annihilationism is viable, its really your choice, but if you choose to do so, please keep your suicidal thoughts out of this forum, here people want to be, here people are cultivating their will in order to forge and purify Self.

Peace,
Abraxas




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