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Reality isn't real DP/DR free


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#37 never_giving_up

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Posted 06 November 2010 - 06:58 AM

Who me?


I originally posted that in confusion to the OP's post.

#38 gill

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Posted 06 November 2010 - 12:41 PM

How do you know what is usually meant by "objective" ? Look up the word Objective in a dictionary and that's what it means in the English glossary.

... Take for instance a chair, it exists as an object in the external world but without your own human subjective understanding of the chair and it's purpose which is for your human ass to sit on it and lets say you the subjective conscious observer of the chair had no ass or no use to sit in a chair, the objective meaning of the chair would be pretty much useless to you subjectively wouldn't it? It would just be a pile of wooden sticks put together craft fully . Would you still consider it an accepted truth, a universal standard, objective reality ? ...


Ok. But, if someone were to say, measure the mass of that chair, since the quantity of 'mass' doesn't depend on the subject's bias, I'd consider that measurement an objective measurement, in the formal sense.

Informally, just two people agreeing the chair is even there, occupying space, would be 'objective reality'.

That's what I meant, and is usually meant by it......

#39 UniversalShape

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Posted 06 November 2010 - 05:37 PM

Don't you see you are saying that you know OBJECTIVELY how things are. Saying that EVERYONE perceives reality ENTIRELY subjectively is an ABSOLUTE OBJECTIVE STATEMENT. You are making a claim to truth.



I never said people couldn't make objective statements from a subjective point of view, I actually pointed this out already when I said that we develop a world view in order to consensually agree on what the world is and we get so wrapped up in that perception that cultural/ human point of view that most of us assume that's all it is. You are the case and point you are so wrapped up in your world view that you cannot see beyond it, We believe it so much that we don't like it shaken up.

Now there is a big difference between having the ability to make objective statements from a subjective point of view which is what every human is capable of and actually perceiving objective reality as it exists in actuality with out a personal subjective perspective.

Ok. But, if someone were to say, measure the mass of that chair, since the quantity of 'mass' doesn't depend on the subject's bias, I'd consider that measurement an objective measurement, in the formal sense.

Informally, just two people agreeing the chair is even there, occupying space, would be 'objective reality'.

That's what I meant, and is usually meant by it......


You might want to look deeper into quantum mechanics,

I could see that no matter how much I'm going to explain, you are going to be inclined to disagree since you all live in your own subjective reality tunnels.

Anyways if anyone has a direct question about dp/dr and symptoms, send a pm and i would be more than happy to offer a word of advice.

#40 flat

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Posted 07 November 2010 - 01:39 AM

"I see that no matter how much I'm going to explain, you are going to be inclined to disagree since you all live in your own subjective reality tunnels"

That's because it's just philosophical. It only exists in your own way of looking at things. There is no objective proof to what you are saying.

#41 flat

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Posted 07 November 2010 - 09:44 AM

I think the confusing part is that all reality has a subjective basis attached to it. There is reality that doesn't need any subjective introspection. For example, a volcano erupts, an earthquake rocks the land. This is just physical reality that needs no subjective thought on why or how it exists. It's just matter (atoms) in motion. It exists no matter how you want to perceive it.

Another example is aliens. Now you can have an "opinion" about aliens. Yes they are here or no they are not. But the fact on whether you subjectively view the existence or non-existence of life on other planets doesn't change the physical reality of their existence...or non-existence. That's why objective proof is so important. It is there for everyone to see, no matter how subjectively you want to see it.

I rest my case.

#42 UniversalShape

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Posted 07 November 2010 - 07:35 PM

"I see that no matter how much I'm going to explain, you are going to be inclined to disagree since you all live in your own subjective reality tunnels"

That's because it's just philosophical. It only exists in your own way of looking at things. There is no objective proof to what you are saying.


One doesn't need objective proof for one's own existence, that is just your way of looking at things. From a material perspective. All it is, is an opinion.

#43 JackDanielß

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:52 PM

I think this might be what Fearless is trying to say.




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