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extacy induced dp/dr depression


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#1 Guest_manchild_*

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 12:37 PM

after trying extacy on one occasion i feel it has left me with on going mental problems. i feel i am suffering from depression and depersonalisation/derealistaion. . I have never before had any mental problems or experemented with any other drugs besides cannibas (not a reglar smoker). I at the moment feel quite helpless. i feel that i may never have the life back that i had before i tried the drug. :cry:
My biggest fear is that i have damaged my brain and thus will be stuck with this conditon forever.

Has/Is any one out there suffered from extacy induced DP/DR?
And more so, did you get over it 100% (Did u ever completely return to what u considered normal)? (or do u know if it is possible?)

#2 Guest_manchild_*

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 01:06 PM

Please dont get me wrong, i havnt lost hope, i am SO determined to beat this. We are faced with many obstacles in our lives we must get over. But sometimes i wonder if im trying to work miracles. I spose i just need to know that it is possible. I realise that people do get over it completly, but i just havnt heard of many stories from people with the drug induced condition. I feel that im in a different boat to most other people with this condtion as there is no on going reason why i should be suffering from this as opposed to people who suffer it from an anxiety perspecitve.

#3 Guest_manchild_*

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 01:42 PM

wow i really feel quite stupid replying so much to my own posts. :lol:
But i have just read one of the personal stories in the archive section It was the story of katherine. i really think she may be on to something here. I think the key lies in the fact that beause it affects your consciousness it is something near impossible to ignore. Thus by subciounsly telling yourself you feel this way, it creates/reinforces these feelings in turn again. Its like one viscous circle. I think this would explain while when i relax and stop worrying about it i feel somewhat relieved.

I have also have had brief experiences in the past where i have felt "normal". I think that these may be due to the fact that my mind has wandered and "snapped" out of the circular theory your mind creates. However the when i started getting conscious of this "normal" state and started thinking every five seconds "do i still feel normal" it slowly returned because i started this circular theory again.

Just a theory but something i found very usefull.

I WILL BEAT THIS #*@$#* :twisted:
Its all in the head people!!

#4 dalailama15

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 09:51 PM

Manchild and Angela,

I am in the same boat as you. And I am experimenting with a theory, the simplest and most obvious one. THC and XTC for some people affect some physiological change in the brain. There is no reason to believe it is irreversable, and it is likely that it can be affected by thought. . . but there is also no reason to believe it is caused by some psychological defense mechanism, or by some kind of bad self talk.

I am tired of trying to believe, with no real evidence, that I am in some way doing this to myself for some obscure reason.

There are those here who simply dont think that introducing THC or XTC into the systems of otherwise healthy young people can cause these same specific sets of dissociative symptoms. We know they are wrong.

And I am beginning to suspect that the only reason some disbelieve the truth of our own lives is that it conflicts with their own pat explanations. And so, like true believers, they dismiss and ignore.

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 10:17 PM

THC and XTC for some people affect some physiological change in the brain.


Dalai, What's your take on DP/DR that begins as a result of too much caffeine, i.e., caffeine overdose? Are you inclined to believe that caffeine, either in pill form or liquid, can create the same sort of change in the brain as X?

Just curious.

Thanks for your input.

Jeff

#6 dalailama15

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 10:40 PM

And, at least for me, I see no reason to continue searching for the thing that was already there, the thing that the drugs triggered or uncovered. . . when I see no compelling evidence that such a thing even exists.

#7 dalailama15

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 11:16 PM

Jeff, you spoiled the drama, the stinger, of the second post just below the first. :-)

To your question: although I'm no molecular biologist (and just blew the audition to play one on TV) I don't see why not. And I certainly don't think you should feel any preasure, unless otherwise indicated, to come up with other reasons. (Don't take my word for any of this; I'm just, at this point, guessing.)

I want to add that I am not necessarily talking about brain damage. And your experience with caffine (quite a bit less chemically invasive that XTC or THC) makes the idea of damage even less likely. This, I think is good news for all of us.

Some have described the amygdala as a switch, directing neural energy and sensory information either backwards, stimulating the the four F parts of the brain(feed, fight, flee, and reproduce)--the parts we share with our reptile friends (who don't take care of their young, who feel no affection, who never play)--or forwards, stimulating the primate parts of the brain, and then our overgrown frontal lobes--the reasoning, speaking, planning and creating parts. And the amygdala, I beleive, "learns" through memory, through desensitization, through stimulous and response, through positive and negative feedback, and then "teaches" the organism (actually the mammal--we share this organ with all of them), to recognize, for example, what is life threatening, and what is similar but harmless.

We may have just made this switch a little sticky (god I'm really speculating here) and there could easily be some chemical WD40, and just as likely, some behavioral WD40 as well.

#8 stickdude

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 11:23 PM

man this freaks me out because i am going through the EXACT SAME boat as you are and i came on this forum looking through topics to make me feel better, and what do i know, a topic that is just what happend to me. i sometimes feel like myself, but that's when i don't think about it. when i start to think about it, that's when i start to think i have some sort of brain damage. i have no idea how to break the cycle, and i'm guessing only time can tell. my only wish is to feel like my old self, no panic attacks going anywhere, no anxiety walking around thinking if the world is real and if people are. all of this happend after i took ecstasy around june (2 months ago). i'm just praying all of this is depersonlization/derealization and no permenent effects on my brain has happend and i will come to normal someday and not become insane or have crazy delusions.

seeing this topic makes me wonder even more if people are real.

#9 dalailama15

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Posted 15 August 2004 - 11:37 PM

Dude, I don't think it is damage. I really don't. See my "sticky" theory above.

And the reason I am virtually sure it is not damage, is this: virtually everyone who has participated in this community has thought the exact same thing, has had the exact same fear: I am in some way irreperably damaged. This, no matter what the causes of their DP and DR.

And many have recovered fully and many are much better, and all are here to help and to share, and to, above all, reassure.

Don't give up. Don't freak out. There is lots and lots of hope.

#10 Guest_manchild_*

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 02:42 AM

stick dude
look at it this way. There are thousands and thousands of people every year who try extacy and most come out of the experience with no negative side effects. Since our brains are all made of the same matter there is no logical reason why brain damage would occur in some people and not others. The only difference between every one that takes it is their thought processes and their experience taking it.

The way i understand why it happens ,as someone else on this forum put it .
Drug use/trauma ----> feeling of not being in control/ extreme stress
------> defence mechanism (DP/DR)

I wonder very strongly if it was my thought proccesses while i was experiencing the effects. While coming up i felt quite scared, i was feeling all these really powerful things that while they were really good also freaked me out as i wasnt in control of them. This led to a short panic attack. A friend calmed me down after i continued to to enjoy my night. Another factor which may of contributed was my fear for xtc in the first place, as i did all the research on the negative side effects and was quite worried about if it would damage me in any way. I however decided in my mind to take the risk while however being concerned. This was also something i continued to worry about after trying the drug

Stickman can you draw ay parralels between this and your experience?? Did u have any fears/anxieties about the drug experience or fears/anxieties while you were on it??

#11 stickdude

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 10:54 AM

Stickman can you draw ay parralels between this and your experience?? Did u have any fears/anxieties about the drug experience or fears/anxieties while you were on it??


i was sorta anxious before taking it. i didn't really want to mess with it but after tons and tons of research (researched the hell out of it), i came to the conclusion that it would be safe as no one has died unless of dehydration, drinking too much, or overdose. right before i took it i was a little anxious, then i took it and tried to take my mind off it. the experience was really great, except for the end. i went to go take a piss, then as i was about to leave, i lost my audio for about 5 seconds. i was freaking out thinking for sure i was going to die. my two friends were talking and i was saying in horror "i can't hear anything, oh god". i went to put my face in cold water in the sink then i started hearing again. i was freaked out thinking i got brain damage or was soon gonna die. ever since, i've have terrible anxiety, derealization, depersonalization. i hope it gets better.

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 03:21 AM

I suffered a year long bout of DR/Panic/Anxiety after taking too many pills...for about two months I'd been taking them with no problems, but one day (during a comedown) I too far too much - and after the 'high' I had an enormous panic attack which resulted in the DR/DP. If it's any comfort, I've been DR/DP free for years, and despite loads of stress I've been through, it's never come back. Never.

Don't look into too deeply. It's very simple what has happened. You took a chemical which (after the inital flood) emptied your brain of seretonin - which caused anxiety, panic and.....drum roll......DR/DP. This is a natural reaction. The trick is how NOT to get 'stuck with DR/DP after the inital panic has faded. It's a trick that's not easily learned, but whose answer is really quite simple.

It's true that 'e' can cause seretonic damage after heavy abuse and that's definately a very bad idea, but I don't think that short term, occassional use (whether or not it causes panic) will PERMANENTLY damage your brain. There are a lot of scare stories about, of course, but as with everything they are wildly exaggerated. My experience with 'e' has definately left me more prone to anxiety, but then again I took an enormous amount over quite a long period. Que sera sera.

Forget about taking the 'e'....it's gone, it's happned, it's history. Concentrate on recovering.




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